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View Full Version : German Masters - 1st round and wildcard round discussion



Odrl
31st January 2012, 03:09 PM
Right, major ranking snooker continues this week, with an event I am particularly looking forward to. It was a great success last year, with big crowds for every match, and some great snooker thrown in. It also features my favourite length of matches for this type of event, although the event is unfortunately two days short. :)

Personally, I wasn't a big fan of the setup last year. The outside tables were great, but the main table seemed too far from the audience, and it seemed like it wasn't anyone's main focus. From watching it on TV, I found the atmosphere somewhat lacking early on, but that all changed when only the main table remained. If it was up to me, I would just take the main table out until the final, still leaving a choice of matches for the audience, and televise two (or preferably all four) of the outside tables. Of course I would also like to extend the event for an additional two days. I can see the point of trying to push as much of the action as possible towards the weekend, but I think this event doesn't really need that, because it's very well supported as it is. Anyway, this is a discussion for another time...

Let's look at the draw instead:

Quarter 1:

Mark Williams v. K.Doherty/P.Einsle
Stuart Bingham v. Peter Ebdon
Stephen Lee v. A.Gunnell/P.Bullen
Ding Junhui v. Yu D./C.Norbury

A very interesting first quarter, with Mark Williams and Ding Junhui once again scheduled to meet in the QF. There is a lot of work to be done first though. Williams is the defending champion and an "overseas" specialist, and with his rather mediocre performances at the UK and the Masters, I would expect him to be on his game here. He will probably play Ken Doherty in the 1st round, in the repeat of the SF from Australia at the start of the season, a match Williams won comfortably. We haven't seen much of Doherty since then, but I guess that is to be expected, as he has had no consistency whatsoever in the last couple of seasons. His wildcard match against Patrick Einsle could be interesting in its own right. The two players actually played a frame against each other at the World Cup in July, and it was Einsle who won on that occasion. I think there is a chance of an upset here. Then we also have Stuart Bingham and Peter Ebdon, in what is one of the three or four most interesting matches of the 1st round. Bingham is the seeded player at this point in time, so he would have to be favourite, but Ebdon can still be very dangerous on his day. And he hasn't had his day for quite a while now, which could be in his favour. The 2nd round here could be another Australian repeat, this time the final, if the two seeded players come through. At the end of the day though, I think Williams is a pretty strong favourite here.

The second part of this quarter also features some interesting names, Ding Junhui in particular. I guess he is one of the more underwhelming players of the season so far, at least as far as the top players are concerned. I would expect him to find a bit of form sooner of later, in fact, he played good snooker at times at the UK. He could play another Chinese player in the 1st round here, Yu Delu. I am not sure how often these two have played each other, only the 2007 Shanghai Masters springs to mind, but surely they must have met a couple of times outside of the Main Tour. We mostly know Yu from the wildcard rounds of the Chinese events, so this is a rare TV appearance outside of China for him, and it will be interesting to see how he copes. I wouldn't completely rule out an upset here either. The other player to consider here would be Stephen Lee, who has regained most of his consistency over the last two seasons, and is now dangerous in most events. He lost to Ding at the China Open in 2011, a tournament where both players were on their game, and if they should meet again, I think Ding has to be the favourite.

Quarter 2:

Allister Carter v. Joe Perry
Ronnie O'Sullivan v. Andrew Higginson
Matthew Stevens v. M.Dunn/C.Steadman
Neil Robertson v. Marcus Campbell

I would consider the second quarter a pretty weak one, but it will be interesting to see how it plays out nonetheless. Ali Carter and Ronnie O'Sullivan are two of the seeded players, and we all know how this particular pairing usually goes. So, if Carter is to go through, he would probably need O'Sullivan to go out in the 1st round. Well... we all know how he can sometimes play abroad, if he turns up at all. He has a pretty handy opponent in Higginson, a player well capable of beating anyone, but also a player who should suit O'Sullivan in many ways. Higginson plays quite fast, doesn't over think situations, and certainly doesn't get involved in any mind games or anything like that. What about Carter himself? He is certainly not guaranteed to go through here. His match against Perry will be a repeat of the World semi-final of 2008, a match that went very close. Perry has been somewhat quiet over the last season or so, going from a decent top16 player to an occasional qualifier, while Carter's season has been awful so far, with no notable results whatsoever, so I find this match very hard to predict. With no really strong contender here, I have to go for O'Sullivan to come through.

The second part of this quarter does feature a big name, but as usual, I will try to find a reason for his potential failure. There is no doubt Robertson played great snooker at the Masters, perhaps not his most fluent game, but certainly his hardest and most determined. In that mode, he is very hard to stop. But as we have seen in the past with players who play a similar game, it's very hard to hold that kind of determination and competitiveness all the time, especially after you've just had a major success. I thought Robertson looked pretty good in Germany last year, but he still lost against Hamilton in the 1st round. It's no secret that his preparation is sometimes not ideal, so it will be interesting to see what kind of mood he is in this week. Having played a pretty strong tournament in China this season, perhaps he is up for Germany as well. I would predict an early exit, but looking at his opposition, he has a reasonably easy draw. He first needs to get past Marcus Campbell, a great battler who certainly won't make it easy, then it's probably going to be Matthew Stevens... Not sure what more to say about Stevens, he continually finds new ways to lose big matches, but he has been reaching some later stages in the last two seasons, so if Robertson is off his game, Stevens could take advantage.

Quarter 3:

Mark Selby v. Liu S./S.Sari
Graeme Dott v. James Wattana
Martin Gould v. Ricky Walden
Shaun Murphy v. Barry Hawkins

On to the bottom half, a very interesting third quarter of the draw. Mark Selby is once again a favourite to come through, and he needs a good result here, after somewhat disappointing performances in the recent big two events. He was in a similar position last year, needing a good result after a disappointing Masters, and he managed to reach the final. I think he will respond well again. He is now consistently beating his early opponents, so I would not expect Liu Song (or indeed Sari) to give him any major trouble, but his 2nd round opponent should be more difficult, especially if it's Graeme Dott. This would be a repeat of the semi-final last year, a great match which Selby won, and also another in the series of meetings between the two in recent times. I don't think either player has the edge in their rivalry at this point, so I would have to go for Selby as the higher seed. I think this could be a high-quality part of the draw actually, as both players are pretty good travelers, with good records outside of the UK, so in a way it's a shame they have drawn each other so early.

There are more contenders for the other QF spot, in fact, all four players have a decent chance. Let's start with Murphy, the biggest name here. During the Masters week, I thought he looked the best out of all players, the final was his only slightly poor match. He is obviously in good form, and unlike Robertson, he will still have the hunger now that he lost the final. It's been a while since he last won even a standard ranking event, although he has won a couple of minor titles recently. I think the Masters was his best major event for quite some time, which must be encouraging for him. The draw here is not exactly easy, but it's not too bad either, at least not until the QF. First there is Barry Hawkins, the shoot-out winner, although I'm not sure that's going to be in his favour here. He is a very good player on his day, a solid tactical game and breakbuilding at his own measured pace. The question is, does he have the firepower to beat an in-form Murphy? Do Gould or Walden? Gould in particular has found it a struggle to play Murphy in recent times, losing a couple of matches against him on the big stage. I think there is a big difference in experience between them, after all, Murphy played quite similar to Gould when he first came on the scene. But these days he is a very solid player, and you need a bit of tactical awareness to take him out. I think the better bet here is Ricky Walden, whom we didn't see at the Masters, but his performance in the UK was very good. In fact, it was he that took out Murphy on that occasion. He is another very good traveler, with some very good results in the Chinese events in the past. I think his match against Gould is one of the most promising 1st round prospects, and if it's anything like their match at the China Open last season, I am very much looking forward to it. As for the winner of this part of the draw, I'm still sticking with Murphy.

Quarter 4:

Judd Trump v. P.Davison/K.Wrobel
Mark Allen v. T.Ford/P.Arnold
Stephen Maguire v. Ryan Day
John Higgins v. Mark Davis

And finally the bottom quarter, a decent contender for the strongest quarter in my opinion. The 2nd round could see a repeat of the UK final, should see actually, as both players have quite reasonable opponents in the 1st round. I think Trump might be past his form peak at this point, but he has found that consistently decent game that should see him through against the slightly lesser players. The only danger perhaps could be the type of opponent he will be facing, a slow, hard battler, so he should look to take his chances and not let it become a scrap. We have seen how hard Krzysztof Wrobel tries at the World Cup earlier in the season, and I'm sure he will battle for every ball here as well. Then we have Mark Allen, likely to face a more established player in Tom Ford. Ford could be quite dangerous, having won a PTC not so long ago, but Allen clearly has the edge over him. They played two big matches in 2010, the WC and the UK, Allen won them both quite comfortably. What about the 2nd round then? Well, both players have had some success abroad, perhaps Allen more consistently than Trump, and I think he will be hungrier for a win here.

And the final spot? Once again, it could go to four players, but Higgins and Maguire stand out a bit. Not sure what to say about Higgins... we can talk about his great B-game again, his good record in the early rounds, the fact he is the World Champion I suppose, but I've said this ahead of pretty much every event this season, and it's been mostly disappointing from Higgins. I do think his form will pick up though. The mental batteries will surely re-charge at some point, and the hunger will come back. He won the UK and the WC with an extremely determined and concentrated game, kind of like the one Robertson played at the Masters, and he needs that sort of mode if he is to challenge for further titles. Mark Davis is not the easiest of opponents these days, so Higgins will have to be on it right from the start. Stephen Maguire? Once again I can only repeat myself and mention his lack of titles for the last couple of seasons, his occasional good performances in single matches, my feeling that his good form is just around the corner, but it never quite seems to happen for him. It doesn't help that he is facing Ryan Day in the 1st round either. Ok, Day hasn't done anything significant recently, but he is another "overseas" specialist who could take advantage here if the two seeds are off their game. If it should be Higgins against Maguire in the 2nd round, how is that likely to go? Hard to say again... Higgins has had more success in their recent matches, but he didn't win at the UK last month, so Maguire might have the slightest of edges.

Possible QF lineup:

Mark Williams v. Ding Junhui
Ronnie O'Sullivan v. Matthew Stevens
Mark Selby v. Shaun Murphy
Mark Allen v. Stephen Maguire


So, a slightly less "safe" prediction this time, and I got it on time as well! :)

It should be a good snooker week, bring it on! :)

gazza147
31st January 2012, 03:25 PM
Quarter 1:

Mark Williams v. K.Doherty/P.Einsle
Stuart Bingham v. Peter Ebdon
Stephen Lee v. A.Gunnell/P.Bullen
Ding Junhui v. Yu D./C.Norbury


Quarter 2:

Allister Carter v. Joe Perry
Ronnie O'Sullivan v. Andrew Higginson
Matthew Stevens v. M.Dunn/C.Steadman
Neil Robertson v. Marcus Campbell


Quarter 3:

Mark Selby v. Liu S./S.Sari
Graeme Dott v. James Wattana
Martin Gould v. Ricky Walden
Shaun Murphy v. Barry Hawkins



Quarter 4:

Judd Trump v. P.Davison/K.Wrobel
Mark Allen v. T.Ford/P.Arnold
Stephen Maguire v. Ryan Day
John Higgins v. Mark Davis

HunRon
31st January 2012, 03:57 PM
Quarter 1:

Mark Williams v. K.Doherty/P.Einsle
Stuart Bingham v. Peter Ebdon
Stephen Lee v. A.Gunnell/P.Bullen
Ding Junhui v. Yu D./C.Norbury


Quarter 2:

Allister Carter v. Joe Perry
Ronnie O'Sullivan v. Andrew Higginson
Matthew Stevens v. M.Dunn/C.Steadman
Neil Robertson v. Marcus Campbell


Quarter 3:

Mark Selby v. Liu S./S.Sari
Graeme Dott v. James Wattana
Martin Gould v. Ricky Walden
Shaun Murphy v. Barry Hawkins



Quarter 4:

Judd Trump v. P.Davison/K.Wrobel
Mark Allen v. T.Ford/P.Arnold
Stephen Maguire v. Ryan Day
John Higgins v. Mark Davis

daffie
31st January 2012, 04:12 PM
Looking forward to this one! Can anyone tell me the format / length of the matches in the German Masters? I'm hoping for somewhat lengthier matches...like in the good ol' days.

gazza147
31st January 2012, 04:42 PM
Yes All matches up until Quarter-Finals are best of nine frames. Semi-Finals are Best of 11 and the Final is best of 17.

Hope this Helps.


Gaz.

daffie
31st January 2012, 04:44 PM
Cheers! Will have to "wait" untill the semis for the longer frame matches....

montoya10
31st January 2012, 05:04 PM
Ding, Stevens or Ronnie for the title.
Likes of Williams and Selby are a little bit more of dark horses in this one, in my opinion.
I have a feeling that Martin Gould is ready to make a surprise in this one, although considering his current level, Gould winning against any opponent wouldn't make it an exact upset for me.

Looking forward to this one : )

*Advertorial*
Also, still anyone here not entered the fantasy game? Please form your team before it's too late!

SnookerFan
31st January 2012, 05:17 PM
If you expect somebody to make a surprise, is is truly a surprise?

montoya10
31st January 2012, 06:31 PM
If you expect somebody to make a surprise, is is truly a surprise?

Pretty good logic.
But I consider a surprise as a counter against general consensus, not my own opinion.
So, in reality, it is not a surprise for me (=

Looki
31st January 2012, 08:14 PM
A lot of improving to do for Williams if he's to defend his title. After Shanghai I think he's been poor for his standard. My wild guess for the winner: Maguire.

LittleMissAlexa
1st February 2012, 01:33 AM
I quite fancy a shock in the Ding match Yu along with Li Yan have been the two best tour debutants this season i also fancy perry to beat carter and Hawkins to shock murphy remember there isnt much of a gulf in the top thirty two these days

SnookerFan
1st February 2012, 08:19 AM
As there isn't much coverage on tonight, I'm getting Ken Doherty's 9am match taped to watch this evening. It's a shame a potential Mark Williams vs Ken Doherty match isn't on Eurosport.

Though Ken is good at losing these days.

daffie
1st February 2012, 09:19 AM
What is it with Ken the past seasons? He hasn't performed well, like he used to as former World Champion. I really like Ken as a player and person as well. Seems like he doesn't get as much attention from bbc / eurosport like other players get...seems like he's under the radar most of the time. Just wondering...

gazza147
1st February 2012, 11:19 AM
Ken should win quite easy today thou hes 3-1 up and in the Balls!!

daffie
1st February 2012, 11:19 AM
Ken should win quite easy today thou hes 3-1 up and in the Balls!! Oh man don't tell me this...I plan on watching everything later on ;)

LittleMissAlexa
1st February 2012, 11:28 AM
I do not think european wildcard rounds have the same strength as asian ones

PatBlock
1st February 2012, 11:53 AM
What is it with Ken the past seasons? He hasn't performed well, like he used to as former World Champion. I really like Ken as a player and person as well. Seems like he doesn't get as much attention from bbc / eurosport like other players get...seems like he's under the radar most of the time. Just wondering...

Suppose he's just getting older, that's all. He's now languishing around the 30s in the rankings, and I don't expect to see a Williams-like return to form from him unfortunately, as you say, nice bloke, maybe too nice? I've often wondered about Ken's killer instinct.

He's done OK so far today though, with a good 5 - 1 win over Einsle

-

gazza147
1st February 2012, 12:02 PM
Fans of Ken Please dont take this the Wrong Way he is a Loverly guy as I have meet him a few times and what a loverly bloke, but I never thought he was Somebody who Stood Out like some of the Others he was Good in Patches but very Unconsistant and if you watch his Cueing for the 1st Time you wouldnt think he has Won anything as everything is Wrong! And I dont think that has helped him either when hes playing Bad it Shows alot more.

daffie
1st February 2012, 02:35 PM
Suppose he's just getting older, that's all. He's now languishing around the 30s in the rankings, and I don't expect to see a Williams-like return to form from him unfortunately, as you say, nice bloke, maybe too nice? I've often wondered about Ken's killer instinct. He's done OK so far today though, with a good 5 - 1 win over Einsle - You're right, maybe Ken's time was back then when he won the WC and somehow can't compete to the level necessary these days...nevermind the difference in style of play nowadays (very attacking, little safetyplay) compared to the earlier years. Too bad cause I really like Ken. Btw he does great commentating...hopefully he'll continue doing that.

Ronnie's tip
1st February 2012, 04:19 PM
I've always liked Ken - he was a top player 10 years ago, though I agree with the guy who said he lacked killer instinct. He's always been a second-tier player to me though, in that he always seemed to lose against the 'big boys'.

Looking at his record now, he's been in 17 ranking finals and won only 4 of them. In fairness though was up against Hendry, O'Sullivan, Williams and Higgins so it's understandable. Lost in 2 Masters finals aswell to Higgins + Stevens.

Can't see him making a comeback though - his career is done IMO. I'm not too keen on him as a pundit/commentator either. Much prefer Davis, Parrot and Hendry.

edit:

Why isn't Mark Davis in this draw (couldn't see his name)? He won his qualifying matches...

montoya10
1st February 2012, 05:10 PM
Why isn't Mark Davis in this draw (couldn't see his name)? He won his qualifying matches...

He is due to play John Higgins this evening and his name is at the bottom of the draw.

PatBlock
1st February 2012, 05:43 PM
....also fancy perry to beat carter and Hawkins to shock murphy...

Good call on the Murphy match, I thought Hawkins was going to take it there in the 8th, but then he missed a relatively easy red, and that was that. I wasn't able to watch the final frame, was it a close one?

-

PatBlock
1st February 2012, 05:53 PM
...I'm not too keen on him as a pundit/commentator either.

I like Ken, but I have to agree with you there, although he's getting better at it IMO, think he's had a bit of commentary coaching from someone because I though he was much better in the Masters than usual, less frantic and generally more considered.

-

montoya10
1st February 2012, 06:02 PM
Good call on the Murphy match, I thought Hawkins was going to take it there in the 8th, but then he missed a relatively easy red, and that was that. I wasn't able to watch the final frame, was it a close one?

-

Hawk missed an unbelievably easy red to the middle and I just shut it off. I guess that was the end as he let Murphy in.

PatBlock
1st February 2012, 06:07 PM
Hawk missed an unbelievably easy red to the middle and I just shut it off. I guess that was the end as he let Murphy in.

I see, thanks. You not a big Murphy fan then?:D

-

montoya10
1st February 2012, 06:12 PM
I see, thanks. You not a big Murphy fan then?:D

-

Absolutely true :D
But apart from that, I didn't exaggerate the shot. It was a very heavy contact, I suppose.

merlin1234
1st February 2012, 06:28 PM
I like Ken, but I have to agree with you there, although he's getting better at it IMO, think he's had a bit of commentary coaching from someone because I though he was much better in the Masters than usual, less frantic and generally more considered.

-

I noticed that, wondered if it was a conscious thing. It soudned to me like he was trying to speak a little bit more slowly and clearly, and he was using a lower register of his voice, sort of trying to make things sound a little more dramatic.

I've been appreciating Neal Foulds work a little bit more of late. I didn't warm to him at first but I've started noticing how accurate and concise his calls are, lot less splashing around than some of the other commentators.

PatBlock
1st February 2012, 07:20 PM
I noticed that, wondered if it was a conscious thing. It soudned to me like he was trying to speak a little bit more slowly and clearly, and he was using a lower register of his voice, sort of trying to make things sound a little more dramatic.


Exactly what I thought.



I've been appreciating Neal Foulds work a little bit more of late. I didn't warm to him at first but I've started noticing how accurate and concise his calls are, lot less splashing around than some of the other commentators.

Yeah, definitely my pick of the 'new breed' of commentators, he has a very accurate eye, knows when to keep quiet, and doesn't feel the need to constantly demonstrate how witty he is. You know he's class because the BBC don't use him any more. ;)

-

merlin1234
1st February 2012, 07:39 PM
iirc I've heard him with Clive Everton a couple of times, good combo. Foulds and Phil Yates also.

Sam1036
1st February 2012, 08:09 PM
No way of watching tonight?

Doesn't seem to be on eurosport or liveworldsnookertv.

PatBlock
1st February 2012, 08:12 PM
So tonight we've got:

MARK WILLIAMS V KEN DOHERTY

JOHN HIGGINS V MARK DAVIS

STUART BINGHAM V PETER EBDON

STEPHEN LEE V ADRIAN GUNNELL

MARTIN GOULD V RICKY WALDEN

Looks like there's no streaming so just live scores here:
http://livescores.worldsnookerdata.com/LiveScores.aspx?t=957

-

PatBlock
1st February 2012, 08:13 PM
No way of watching tonight?

Doesn't seem to be on eurosport or liveworldsnookertv.

Not much of deal for us British fans is it. :(

-

coomsey76
1st February 2012, 08:17 PM
Not much of deal for us British fans is it. :(

-

It can be done..... I'm now watching the Williams v Doherty match!!:)

PatBlock
1st February 2012, 08:26 PM
It can be done..... I'm now watching the Williams v Doherty match!!:)

Errr, I think you left something out there coomsey??

http://www.hahasport.com/v-2/16/14/v-361585.html
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coomsey76
1st February 2012, 08:55 PM
That's one of watching mate, good find.....!!:)

The other is to watch it on one of the betting websites live streaming!!;)

Eurosports scheduling is so rubbish!!

PatBlock
1st February 2012, 09:20 PM
Williams cruising along here, Ken looking understandably tense. Hope it's not a whitewash.

-

SnookerFan
1st February 2012, 09:57 PM
I was round my parents out, but they Sky Plussed Ken Doherty vs Patrick Einsle for me. Not much of a match. I got back in time to see Ken Doherty and Mark Williams last frame. Not much of a match there either.

Ronnie's tip
1st February 2012, 11:16 PM
Suprised Gould went out.


I noticed that, wondered if it was a conscious thing. It soudned to me like he was trying to speak a little bit more slowly and clearly, and he was using a lower register of his voice, sort of trying to make things sound a little more dramatic.

I've been appreciating Neal Foulds work a little bit more of late. I didn't warm to him at first but I've started noticing how accurate and concise his calls are, lot less splashing around than some of the other commentators.

Agreed.

If it was up to me I'd have Parrot, Davis and Hendry rotating as pundits and Everton, Foulds, Hendry (great in both roles) and Virgo/Taylor (because I've grown up with them) as their back ups. Get rid of Docherty, Thorne, Griffiths.

Dennis Taylor annoys me these days. In every match he sucks up to the crowd "Great crowd here today", "The crowd here are always fair" ect ect.

I don't think the players like Virgo much. Mark Williams definately doesn't.

LittleMissAlexa
1st February 2012, 11:53 PM
Im here to eat humble pie although i was almost right in the murphy match :(

Odrl
2nd February 2012, 10:53 AM
Bad signs for Ding Junhui, he has shown very little so far. Pretty good stuff from Yu Delu on the other hand, looks like he isn't scared of taking Ding on.

PatBlock
2nd February 2012, 11:39 AM
...Pretty good stuff from Yu Delu on the other hand, looks like he isn't scared of taking Ding on.

Yes indeed, what about that pink into the yellow pocket! Very entertaining young player.

-

Odrl
2nd February 2012, 11:48 AM
Yes, it's great that he finally got a crack at the Main Tour, after all those successful performances as a wildcard.

I hate to leave this match at 4-1, because it's either going to be a great victory for the underdog, or a great comeback. But what can you do... :)

gazza147
2nd February 2012, 11:53 AM
Yu Delu not on Main Tour Yet! Hes fighting to get on it but if he plays like he has this morning he wont be long before he does althou I do think Ding has Played the Worst I have Ever seen him play!

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 12:00 PM
I think you will find he is he along with Luca Brecel received tour wildcards this season

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 12:06 PM
http://www.worldsnooker.com/staticFiles/ad/98/0,,13165~170157,00.pdf Number 73

missneworleans
2nd February 2012, 12:29 PM
Poor year for Ding...1st round exits in 3 of 4 ranking tournaments so far..could have been 4 of 4
commentators say Yu has problems staying on the tour...wtf he is already through via PTC

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 12:35 PM
Yu is my lowly ranked player in the fantasy game woo hoooo i also predicted this result earlier in the thread

gazza147
2nd February 2012, 12:37 PM
Sorry I Forgot about those 2 getting those Tour Wildcards!

Hes Won 5-3 Great Result for him but Ding didnt really Turn up today I find.


Gaz.

missneworleans
2nd February 2012, 12:44 PM
Impressive comeback from Allen..trailed 4-1 and needed a snooker in the decider..

PatBlock
2nd February 2012, 12:52 PM
So Yu goes on to play Stephen Lee tonight, that should be an interesting match.

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Looki
2nd February 2012, 01:05 PM
Impressive comeback from Allen..trailed 4-1 and needed a snooker in the decider..

It was. They showed the end of the last frame after Ding-Yu match. It was absolutely great! I would've prefered it as the TV match of this morning session.

Ronnie's tip
2nd February 2012, 01:52 PM
Fancy Maguire to shock Higgins when they play. Also have a feeling Higginson will shock O'Sullivan today.

JeeSe
2nd February 2012, 02:11 PM
Ronnie match starts on eurosport at 2:45.. they play at 3?

Seeing as they are an hour ahead... is at at 1:45 here in the UK? or 2:45..

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 02:18 PM
About 45 minutes to go, I guess.
Eurosport coverage is probably not there at the beginning.

Ronnie's tip
2nd February 2012, 02:54 PM
About 45 minutes to go, I guess.
Eurosport coverage is probably not there at the beginning.

Eurosport is a joke. You never know if it's live or not - the whole channel stinks of cheapness.

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 02:59 PM
Eurosport is a joke. You never know if it's live or not - the whole channel stinks of cheapness.

Yeah, they always find a way to irritate their viewers, but, anyway, that's what I'm stuck with, at the moment.

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 03:15 PM
Alarming start for Ronnie. He missed a simple blue to the bottom and then made a poor safety to let Higginson back in.

cuemaxx
2nd February 2012, 03:30 PM
Andrew "the Vulture" Higginson!

missneworleans
2nd February 2012, 03:36 PM
Great stuff from Andrew!

Ronnie's tip
2nd February 2012, 03:38 PM
Ronnie's lost his head. He has been very unlucky in this frame - potted the white after a flick off the brown and Higginson fluked a red, tucked Ronnie up who went for a hit and hope, leaving an easy red for Higginson to pot. Looks like being 3-0.

I called it ;)

Don't think I've ever seen Higginson play so well though.

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 03:40 PM
Ronnie's lost his head. He has been very unlucky in this frame - potted the white after a flick off the brown and Higginson fluked a red, tucked Ronnie up who went for a hit and hope, leaving an easy red for Higginson to pot. Looks like being 3-0.

I called it ;)

Don't think I've ever seen Higginson play so well though.

That Welsh Open comeback against Robertson years ago is a sole sample.
Ronnie hasn't played much and played not-so-good safeties. Not good so far.

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 03:48 PM
If he is going back to qualifying events lets hope he doesnt go to pontins by mistake after all he hasnt been to the qualifiers since ninety four

daffie
2nd February 2012, 03:50 PM
Alarming start for Ronnie. He missed a simple blue to the bottom and then made a poor safety to let Higginson back in. You know what...I really don't care too much anymore for Ronnie doing well in tournaments. Don't get me wrong, I still like Ronnie and watching him play and everything. But his attitude towards the game has been somewhat dissapointing, passing up on most PTC's and only plays when he feels like he absolutely needs to. And this time around he really needed to enter the German Masters, as he otherwise would have to quality for the World. I respect his choices, couldn't have the arrogance not to. But I have my own opinions on his decisions as a top professional snooker-player. I really feel that he needs to enter tournaments, put in the work and effort, and will then get rewarded accordingly with good form and therefore ultimately success. Hey, of course if Ronnie decides that playing (many) tournaments isn't on the top of his list at the moment, and maybe he feels that his family and other stuff should come first at the moment, then that's a choice that I can only respect. But I'm getting the feeling from Ronnie that he has been dead-set against the PTC's from the start, and can't bring himself to put in the work.

Ronnie's tip
2nd February 2012, 03:52 PM
Things go from bad to worse for O'Sullivan. Bit unlucky but his head has clearly gone. It's not he's not even trying with his safety shots.

Should be 4-0 soon.

Ronnie's tip
2nd February 2012, 03:58 PM
What the hell is Ronnie playing at? Bloody idiot.

Doesn't deserve to win the frame after that - or the following shot on the blue.

cueman
2nd February 2012, 03:59 PM
and now the scoreboard has played up when he's got a chance to win a frame. I think people need to get some perspective here, Ronnie has had an awful run right from the kick on the blue in the first frame which led to Higginson getting a chance to clear. Then Higginson followed it up in the 2nd with a good break but the 3rd was all down to luck, Higginson fluked a red, snookered Ronnie frame over. Then 4th frame Ronnie in with a chance and the scoreboard is wrong! Its no wonder he's frustrated!

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 04:00 PM
Its actually ding who has played in the least ptcs of the top players not Ron

beechy1212
2nd February 2012, 04:02 PM
A mate just said Ronnie is ''missing on purpose''. Have to say, i can't see that but you can see why people think it. His shot choices are awful.

Ronnie's tip
2nd February 2012, 04:02 PM
Terrible shot by Ronnie on the pink. Higginson pots both pink/black to make it 4-0.

Ronnie's tip
2nd February 2012, 04:04 PM
and now the scoreboard has played up when he's got a chance to win a frame. I think people need to get some perspective here, Ronnie has had an awful run right from the kick on the blue in the first frame which led to Higginson getting a chance to clear. Then Higginson followed it up in the 2nd with a good break but the 3rd was all down to luck, Higginson fluked a red, snookered Ronnie frame over. Then 4th frame Ronnie in with a chance and the scoreboard is wrong! Its no wonder he's frustrated!

I agree - the last 3 major tournaments (UK, Masters + today) he's definately had some bad luck, or rather his opponents have had the run of the ball, but it's still extremely annoying to watch.

Higginson deserves to be 4-0 up.

cueman
2nd February 2012, 04:11 PM
He's had a season to write off to be fair. Ran into Trump who played out of his skin on no less than 3 occassions, PTC, Masters and UK championships and that is all the major TV competitions we've had. It seems like he just cannot get a win under his belt at the moment, he looked very good against Ding in the Masters but unfortunately Trump wasn't the ideal man to play against. He just needs to get a couple of wins and get his confidence up and he'll probably be flying again. Say what you like about the PTC's though, they are a lottery, best of 7's aren't really ideal for any of the players, that's why we keep seeing different winners, you hit form in one match and you'll win. I think Ronnie and a few of the other top players find the motivation to play these events tough. He's been on the circuit 20 years now so you have to look at it from his perspective.

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 04:12 PM
It really annoys of this myth about Ronnie being the worst offender for missing PTCs and Ding never gets picked both this season and last Ding has played the fewest PTCs disregarding Higgins last season who was suspended for most of them of the top 64 so its about time people got on Dings back Ronnies ranking issues have more to do with missing world ranking events

Ronnie's tip
2nd February 2012, 04:18 PM
Bad luck for Ronnie there....

He's had a season to write off to be fair. Ran into Trump who played out of his skin on no less than 3 occassions, PTC, Masters and UK championships and that is all the major TV competitions we've had. It seems like he just cannot get a win under his belt at the moment, he looked very good against Ding in the Masters but unfortunately Trump wasn't the ideal man to play against. He just needs to get a couple of wins and get his confidence up and he'll probably be flying again. Say what you like about the PTC's though, they are a lottery, best of 7's aren't really ideal for any of the players, that's why we keep seeing different winners, you hit form in one match and you'll win. I think Ronnie and a few of the other top players find the motivation to play these events tough. He's been on the circuit 20 years now so you have to look at it from his perspective.

I thought he was poor against Ding tbh. Had maybe 3 good frames (including last two) but his positional play was terrible and he let Ding get right back into the match.

The frustrating thing for Ronnie fans is that this is the first time in a while that he's had an 'easy' draw. In the WC he faced Dale, Murphy then Higgins, UK it was Davis/Trump and at the Masters it was Ding/Trump.

As arrogant as this sounds, he actually has a free pass to the 1/4 finals here if he plays well because there's no one that can come close to matching him when he's above 80%. With Ding out he now only has Roberton and Williams to worry about before the final and we know Williams is Ronnie's whipping boy these days so this is a HUGE chance for O'Sullivan. He couldn't have asked for an easier draw in all honesty.

Just saw the draw for the Welsh Open and he faces Mark Williams in the 2nd round should he win the 1st, but more importantly he's got Trump AGAIN waiting for him after that so he simply has to do well today. He's got a lot of ranking points to protect in the WO aswell - in 2010 he made it to the semi final.

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 04:23 PM
Bit harsh on Dale after all he is the most successful player to of never made the top sixteen

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 04:26 PM
Bad luck for Ronnie there....


I thought he was poor against Ding tbh. Had maybe 3 good frames (including last two) but his positional play was terrible and he let Ding get right back into the match.

The frustrating thing for Ronnie fans is that this is the first time in a while that he's had an 'easy' draw. In the WC he faced Dale, Murphy then Higgins, UK it was Davis/Trump and at the Masters it was Ding/Trump.

As arrogant as this sounds, he actually has a free pass to the 1/4 finals here if he plays well because there's no one that can come close to matching him when he's above 80%. With Ding out he now only has Roberton and Williams to worry about before the final and we know Williams is Ronnie's whipping boy these days so this is a HUGE chance for O'Sullivan. He couldn't have asked for an easier draw in all honesty.

Just saw the draw for the Welsh Open and he faces Mark Williams in the 2nd round should he win the 1st, but more importantly he's got Trump AGAIN waiting for him after that so he simply has to do well today. He's got a lot of ranking points to protect in the WO aswell - in 2010 he made it to the semi final.

If he's above 80%, he won't need an easy draw, though.

Ronnie's tip
2nd February 2012, 04:29 PM
4-1.


If he's above 80%, he won't need an easy draw, though.

Ronnie's % isn't what it used to be. In the past, a 100% Ronnie would beat everyone regardless of how they're playing. I think a 100% Ronnie today would lose to a 100% Higgins/Trump though. I haven't seen a 100% Ronnie for a long time - years infact. His average is probably 65% of what it used to be.

You could compare him to Federer in that his A game is still the best but his B, C and D games have all dropped.

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 04:31 PM
4-1.



Ronnie's % isn't what it used to be. In the past, a 100% Ronnie would beat everyone regardless of how they're playing. I think a 100% Ronnie today would lose to a 100% Higgins/Trump though. I haven't seen a 100% Ronnie for a long time - years infact. His average is probably 65% of what it used to be.

You could compare him to Federer in that his A game is still the best but his B, C and D games have all dropped.

Higgins? Debatable. I could agree with you.
Trump? I don't think so. Especially if it's a long-format match.

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 04:39 PM
Hes just hit his nineteenth century in a month hit sixteen in the cl two in the masters and now one here all since the ninth of january how many will he get before the ninth of feb i wonder

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 04:44 PM
What a steal it turned out to be.

narl
2nd February 2012, 04:45 PM
You can tell just by looking at o'Sullivan he doesnt want to be there. Not sure why he bothers entering if he would prefer to be elsewhere.

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 04:47 PM
You can tell just by looking at o'Sullivan he doesnt want to be there. Not sure why he bothers entering if he would prefer to be elsewhere.

Pretty much because his mindset fluctuates all the time.

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 04:50 PM
Make that twenty within a month

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 05:05 PM
Higginson looks lost. But Ronnie is definitely not in his own flow.

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 05:07 PM
"If he left this red for Ronnie, that is for me, totally the wrong shot."

Genius commentary, eh?

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 05:08 PM
People of Genius can get bored very easily the game of snooker is too easy for Ron thats why he loses focus

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 05:12 PM
People of Genius can get bored very easily the game of snooker is too easy for Ron thats why he loses focus

Well, he has, at numerous times, stated that he has underachieved. If he really thinks this way, why not giving his head to it a little bit more?
I'm not making critics. One suffering from depression is open to such varying demeanour.

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 05:15 PM
Higginson cuts an awesome black in and misses a sitter. Not ideal stuff to wrap up the match.

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 05:17 PM
Do you think his dissatisfaction with his career night be a trait of a perfectionist

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 05:20 PM
Credit to Ronnie, anyway. He didn't show his occasional "I want out of this arena quickly" attitude. He tried to stick to the match.
He didn't play anywhere near his standard, yes, but he at least tries to stay positive.

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 05:32 PM
He has done it. Somehow.

Ronnie's tip
2nd February 2012, 05:33 PM
Never in doubt!

Happy Ronnie won, but I feel sorry for Higginson. Snookering himself was the turning point. Very carless/unlucky.

montoya10
2nd February 2012, 05:36 PM
Now, it will be interesting to see if he reaches the QF, so that he will have a string of victories after quite a long time.

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 05:38 PM
Is that the comeback of the season so far?

MalJackson
2nd February 2012, 05:51 PM
what a choker perry is!!!

PatBlock
2nd February 2012, 06:00 PM
Oh dear, Higginson must be gutted. But he had his chances, just lost his nerve in the end.
Someone on TSF, can't remember who, has a quote from Frank Herbert's 'DUNE' as their sig, which I think sums it up nicely:

"Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration."

-

Ronnie's tip
2nd February 2012, 06:07 PM
I noticed that the commentary was about a second behind the live pictures. Little things like that annoy me.

Odrl
2nd February 2012, 06:14 PM
Great comeback in the end, not something you would usually expect from O'Sullivan. I think it was that 60-odd clearance that turned the match in his favour. He certainly has a chance to go far in this event. :)

Rane
2nd February 2012, 07:34 PM
This comeback tells a lot about the real top 16 players and the ones hanging around for ages without establishing themselves in top 16. It´s hard to believe that any of the current top 10 would let a fourframe lead slip away even against O´Sullivan.

neil taperell
2nd February 2012, 07:37 PM
Just switched it on........Doherty's highest break in 4 frames...........16 !

gazza147
2nd February 2012, 07:43 PM
Higginson Definatley missed the Boat had 2/3 Easy Chances to Win the Match but Bottled it, I do feel sorry for him but I think this will Kick Ronnie into Gear as Long as his doesnt mess around from the Start again!

As I have already said about Ken its Time I think he stayed in Commentary Box....lol....As I dont think it will be long before this Happens for Real anyway.

JeeSe
2nd February 2012, 07:44 PM
what were the bookies odds on Ronnie once he was 4-0 down? Would of gladly put 20 on.

coomsey76
2nd February 2012, 10:29 PM
So gutted I missed Ronnie's come back.....!!:(

neil taperell
2nd February 2012, 10:33 PM
I missed Higgins comeback as well...................Only joking !

He did not look himself out there tonight . Strange for a player of that quality .

LittleMissAlexa
2nd February 2012, 11:26 PM
Neil your in the wrong thread this is first round higgins is second round

neil taperell
2nd February 2012, 11:39 PM
oops! Sorry :o

gazza147
3rd February 2012, 12:34 AM
Neil I just got in and Seen the Result of Higgins Due to your Post...lol... How did he Lose 5-0 he Must have played terrible which is Not like him as he normally is a very good all round player One of the Best if Not the Best all Round Player.

Let me down for Tonights Acca!.....Dam...lol

daffie
3rd February 2012, 10:12 AM
Neil I just got in and Seen the Result of Higgins Due to your Post...lol... How did he Lose 5-0 he Must have played terrible which is Not like him as he normally is a very good all round player One of the Best if Not the Best all Round Player. Let me down for Tonights Acca!.....Dam...lol *off-topic* can I ask what's the deal with all the caps that you use in regular sentences? Just curious...

gazza147
3rd February 2012, 11:11 AM
Daffie you just joined m8 just enjoy your stay.

daffie
3rd February 2012, 11:20 AM
Daffie you just joined m8 just enjoy your stay. Huh? Did I say anything to offend...didn't think so...definately not my intention. I was just curious, that's all. But nevermind then, thanks anyway for the constructive answer to a polite question. On to more important and interesting things....

cantpotforshíte
3rd February 2012, 11:23 AM
what were the bookies odds on Ronnie once he was 4-0 down? Would of gladly put 20 on.

30/1 on Betfair to win the tournament when he was 4-0 down. I didn't see what he was to win the match.

gazza147
3rd February 2012, 11:27 AM
*off-topic* can I ask what's the deal with all the caps that you use in regular sentences? Just curious...

Daffie I just Use Caps on Words I wanna Stand Out like "How" did "Higgins Lose" thats all no program running to do this just habbit.

Hope this Answers your Question m8 ok.

daffie
3rd February 2012, 11:54 AM
Daffie I just Use Caps on Words I wanna Stand Out like "How" did "Higgins Lose" thats all no program running to do this just habbit. Hope this Answers your Question m8 ok. Ok got it...cheers.