Selecting hard Elks (or any tip, I suppose!)

[timcunnell]

Hello chaps

Like many people, I definitely favor a hard Elk Master on the end of my cue. But I have found that in my case its definitely more luck than judgement in terms of what I get! Talking to the guy who made my cue last year, he was saying that when the get a box of 50 Elks, they're finding that maybe 20 are usable! I found this really quite interesting.

So I've got a box of Elks at home, and I am wondering how to tell which are harder!!? I re-tipped my cue last week - and selected that tip by tapping a few on the dining table and seeing if one felt/sounded harder. I thought one seemed harder than others, but I have been playing with this new tip and although its now bedding in, its softer than vicar's handshake.

I've heard that people "listen" to the tip, while flicking the layers (like flicking the pages of a book) - but this sounded like too much for my tiny mind to handle. I've seen RoS ask his Twitter followers to send him hard Elks in the past!! I don't think I'd get as much luck if I tried that approach!

So my question is, if you've got a box of tips in front of you - how do you know which ones are harder??

[DeanH]

funny where you say Elks are hard, where often others have called Elks soft!

the comment about only having a few in a box that are "good" has been mentioned often as well

flicking the layers? Elks are not laminated but a single layer "pressed".

Trevor White says he checks Elks by using his finger-nails on the sides and try to pull apart (if I got this correct?) to see how compact the tip is.

Many say to check the hardness of a tip is to press your finger nail into the top edge to see how deep it goes, as an indication of the hardness the tip will be.

[strobbekoen]

Good question, and has been covered here at length too.
I recently retipped various cues, 2 out of 5 is about right I think. Some tips are soft, don't keep their shape, while others do. It's trial and error I am afraid. If it's not a good one, I just retip it with another one, doesn't take that long.

[timcunnell]

Thanks guys. Yeah goof point Dean about the layer thing!! I guess when I heard that one it wasn't related to Elks!? And yeah I get what you mean about Elks not generally being hard. I was put onto them a few years ago because they seem to last quite well, and hold their shape/less prone to mushrooming. I was using hard Kamuis, but they have a tendency to crumble (especially with the amount I miscue!!). But yeah on the whole I do find that Elks are softer than I'd like. But every now and then I get a harder one and love it!
I have also seen on here that someone mentioned before about compressing tips in a vice for a day or so before using them. Is that something worth considering??

[DeanH]

pre-compressing - either in a purpose made tip press or as someone said in the bed/table leg
if you prefer then hard, then waiting a night or two before fitting why not try the bed/table leg method, probably wont hurt

not sure about the other thread about soaking tips in milk (?)

[Terry Davidson]

I have had a recent rash of bad tips and am trying to sort my way around it before my next tournament. With the Elks I would let them drop on the cushion rail of my table and listen for a 'click' which means it's a good one while the others where I get a dull thud are definitely what I call 'spongy' and I toss them. Have to admit though that I haven't tried an Elk lately.

I had installed a Talisman S and about 4 days after I mis-cued and the top layer came right off. Previously I never had a problem with the Talisman S tips. I replaced that with a Phoenix MH but I'm finding it isn't taking the chalk very well at all although the hit seems to be pretty good.

I'm going to try one of Andrew's layered soft tips when they come and see how they stand up and how they take the chalk. Previously I've also found the Pro Granite tips to be pretty good with not a lot of re-shaping and they hold the chalk well. Maybe I'll see if I can sort out a good Elk and try that next.

[Byrom]

Thanks guys. Yeah goof point Dean about the layer thing!! I guess when I heard that one it wasn't related to Elks!? And yeah I get what you mean about Elks not generally being hard. I was put onto them a few years ago because they seem to last quite well, and hold their shape/less prone to mushrooming. I was using hard Kamuis, but they have a tendency to crumble (especially with the amount I miscue!!). But yeah on the whole I do find that Elks are softer than I'd like. But every now and then I get a harder one and love it!
I have also seen on here that someone mentioned before about compressing tips in a vice for a day or so before using them. Is that something worth considering??

An hour or so not overnight -

[DeanH]

An hour or so not overnight -

an hour in the tool, longer for under the table leg?
never tried it myself, my do next elk I try

[timcunnell]

Nice one Terry thanks for contributing. I wonder if I need to have a look at other tips then! I had heard good things about the Phoenix and the Pro Granite.

I've just been amazed by just how bad this latest Elk is playing, compared to the last one. I generally play on club league tables which are mostly pretty slow, and yet I've been prone to over-screwing shots of late. And yet playing last night on what is one of the faster tables in my town, I was struggling to get much screw at all! E.g. a straight black into the corner I had to give it some proper welly just to screw back and off the side cushion. With the previous tip on the same table I'd be coming twice across the table and threatening the middle bag at that pace!

I'm gonna try dropping some and listening for a click. The missus is gonna think I've lost the plot! (Maybe she's right!!).

[Byrom]

an hour in the tool, longer for under the table leg?
never tried it myself, my do next elk I try

well under the bed depends on the weight on the bed - roughly 10 mins would do under the wife's side

[DeanH]

well under the bed depends on the weight on the bed - roughly 10 mins would do under the wife's side

as my wife is a member here, I will have to say it would takes weeks on her side :biggrin:

[timcunnell]

Okay I apologise up front for this post - because I have asked some fairly dumb things on here, but this might be the dumbest!!..........
......With reference to the table leg/bed leg thing, does it matter if you have carpet or hard floor?! I have all carpets, so maybe I need to sandwich a tip between the leg and the carpet? Like a coaster or something?

[DeanH]

I always thought I would have a hard backed coaster/placemat on the carpet

[stejohn]

i do a combination of these, first i flick my nail across the side (like a book? this removes a layer of coating to get to the actual tip itself and also with this alone you can find some that feel like the tip is already pulling apart and can be chucked.
Next i dig my nail hard into the side, see if i can make an indentation or not, and pick out a few that seem harder.
Lastly then i bang them on the table hard and listen to the sound they make then drop them from a distance and look for a highter pitched noise.
Sounds like a pain in the arse but by messing with a box of 50 for a few mins i can soon discard practically half and pick out about 10-15 that i feel should be firm and consistent, results are fairly consistent but then i get the odd dud that i bin and retip.

[Dave Walton]

I push my thumb nail into the side of the tip, if it sinks in easily and leaves an indentation its soft, if it won't budge and barely leaves a mark its hard and obviously medium is somewhere between the two