Wet or Dry?

[tetricky]

Toss. Humidity is something you want to eliminate from playing conditions, not encourage. You can brush, block and iron a cloth perfectly well without having to add water. So don't. It's a bad idea.

That appears to be the expert opinion.

Idiot trolls probably take a different view to gain attention.

[barrywhite]

No I'm not missing the point. I played snooker, Probably to a higher standard than you. Owned a club for 30 yrs where I've cleaned and maintained tables. And for good measure been a fitter for 20 yrs. Therefore I can state with a degree of certainty that I've forgotten more about tables and caring for tables than you will ever know. As far as giving you time and effort by trying to educate you, in the words of Duncan Bannantyne 'I'm oot'

Well, all I can say is that it works and it will work until if fails and then I'll let everyone know if and when it did fail. Simply saying don't do it because of chalk build up claggin the cloth ignores the fact that it works and that the cloth won't last +18mths anyway, so a any clagging isn't part of the equation long term because the cloth isn't long term. Once it's had its first restretch, it's had it's only restretch. We've only misted it twice and the restretch is due now. So yeah, maybe mist only after a restretch is sensible (from your advice) but to say don't mist at all because of future restretches is irrelevant. Btw, we had to wet block a really old cloth (think it was 3+ years old) due to it slowing down dramatically, no nap left, you get the picture. Even this cloth didn't crack or damage from 2 years of wet blocking. So it was about 5 yrs old once it came off when he got rid of the table. And 6811 T is a better cloth than that one so should be affected less by misting.

Thankyou for your advice nonetheless.

[maryfield]

No I'm not missing the point. I played snooker, Probably to a higher standard than you. Owned a club for 30 yrs where I've cleaned and maintained tables. And for good measure been a fitter for 20 yrs. Therefore I can state with a degree of certainty that I've forgotten more about tables and caring for tables than you will ever know. As far as giving you time and effort by trying to educate you, in the words of Duncan Bannantyne 'I'm oot'

[barrywhite]

You seem to be missing the point. Geoff is advising against wet blocking as it causes the cloth to harden which makes it impossible to stretch the wear marks when re-stretching cloth. I would defer to Terry Griffiths with respect to playing, technique etc. But as for table fitting I doubt he`s fitted many cloths. Horses for courses.

I think you're missing the point, TG coaches and has played at the highest level. The fitters fit the cloth and leave, they come back for a restretch if it's not a short life cloth. They don't clean the table, they don't play the table, most of em can't play that brilliantly. If TG says wet blocking is good to increase the speed of the cloth, he isn't saying it because he's after a world record cloth, he's saying it for the benefit of players who have to use the table, ie. it will make break building easier, spin shots easier etc. Most fitters aren't bothered about such things because they do their job, get paid and leave. It's then up to the owners to maintain the cloths.

[maryfield]

You seem to be missing the point. Geoff is advising against wet blocking as it causes the cloth to harden which makes it impossible to stretch the wear marks when re-stretching cloth. I would defer to Terry Griffiths with respect to playing, technique etc. But as for table fitting I doubt he`s fitted many cloths. Horses for courses.

[barrywhite]

Geoff when are you going to learn. Forget the 40 years experience you`ve gained and learn from the real experts.

Well, Terry Griffiths advises wet blocking apparently. Does he have any experience?! lol

[maryfield]

Geoff when are you going to learn. Forget the 40 years experience you`ve gained and learn from the real experts.

[barrywhite]

You can always tell a table that has been misted or damped down
the cloth is like cardboard on the re-stretch due to chalk dust binding together in the weave
I have always stated that wool napped cloth should not be damped down or misted or even Starch sprayed on it as some on here have used too .
The only reason people have damped a cloth is to bring some colour back into it as damp cloth is darker than dry cloth , but it will soon goes back to faded used colour when dry

one reason a damped cloth may play faster is when people iron the cloth being as it is wool damp cloth will shrink and become tighter on the bed making a ball roll faster , but the area's of wear at the fall will not be moved like on a re-stretch , stretching is the professional way of speeding a cloth up and also moving the areas of wear of tracking lines down the slate falls , if you use spray or damp cloth this prevents the fitter getting hose areas of wear on the pocket openings way down the fall

The mist works as steam when the iron goes over and so you get a flatter finish after two ironings Geoff. It definitely plays faster otherwise I wouldn't go to the hassle of doing it. But I will only do it when my mate, a very good player wants to practice for Q school. The restretch is due around now, so misting a couple of times isn't going to make a diff. After that, the cloth will be unmoved for the remainder of its life, so again, misting won't matter.

After misting, the colour doesn't change on our table because we double iron to make sure no moisture is left. It's drier after double ironing that before we walked in the room and misted it.

[Geoff Large]

You can always tell a table that has been misted or damped down
the cloth is like cardboard on the re-stretch due to chalk dust binding together in the weave
I have always stated that wool napped cloth should not be damped down or misted or even Starch sprayed on it as some on here have used too .
The only reason people have damped a cloth is to bring some colour back into it as damp cloth is darker than dry cloth , but it will soon goes back to faded used colour when dry

one reason a damped cloth may play faster is when people iron the cloth being as it is wool damp cloth will shrink and become tighter on the bed making a ball roll faster , but the area's of wear at the fall will not be moved like on a re-stretch , stretching is the professional way of speeding a cloth up and also moving the areas of wear of tracking lines down the slate falls , if you use spray or damp cloth this prevents the fitter getting hose areas of wear on the pocket openings way down the fall

[barrywhite]

One thing that makes damping cloth a questionable thing

why do they have heaters under the table ?

the answer is to keep moisture content down and by doing this the cloth plays faster , so why damp or fine mist the cloth ?

If you read my thread on why I think damping is bad you will also get some pointers from that , most do it to bring the colour back into the cloth and that is the main reason really it has no other benefits

Misting makes the cloth smoother, just the same as a steam iron helps to make fabric flatter. Misting and ironing flattens the nap = less friction. Table heaters do increase speed as the balls and cloth are now warmer, meaning the balls keep energy on a roll better, not losing it in friction and heat conduction. Our cloth is 6mths old so it will have to be changed in 6-12mths anyway, so I'm prepared to mist and see what happens to the cloth. I've not known it to damage another table we worked on.

Not everyone, in fact most clubs don't have heaters. We have to adapt the equipment we've got Geoff. We can avoid misting and put up with a slower table or we can mist and get up to the speeds we see on tv. Which is useful for folk who wish to practice for pro/am tournaments or attend Q school.

@markz, if they can't work out how to do a table, the owner should throw them out! Only kidding, some folk are scared of burning a table which isn't a risk at all, even on Dowsing no.9 for pure wool, as long as you keep the iron moving at a nice pace. If you also bear two hands down on the iron and use it the wrong way round, you can impart more pressure and get the nap flatter.

Anyone should be able to brush a table and block from the baulk down, so they should be able to at least that before playing, if not the ironing.

[markz]

One thing that makes damping cloth a questionable thing

why do they have heaters under the table ?

the answer is to keep moisture content down and by doing this the cloth plays faster , so why damp or fine mist the cloth ?

If you read my thread on why I think damping is bad you will also get some pointers from that , most do it to bring the colour back into the cloth and that is the main reason really it has no other benefits

Would you consider doing a video Geoff of brushing, blocking and ironing a table. If more players knew how to do this clubs would have better conditions and maybe more players would stay in the game. A freshly cleaned table makes a hell of a difference.

[Geoff Large]

One thing that makes damping cloth a questionable thing

why do they have heaters under the table ?

the answer is to keep moisture content down and by doing this the cloth plays faster , so why damp or fine mist the cloth ?

If you read my thread on why I think damping is bad you will also get some pointers from that , most do it to bring the colour back into the cloth and that is the main reason really it has no other benefits

[barrywhite]

Geoff Large - 40 years fitting experience, I'll take his advice.

You used to sing delicious ballads, pal. Leave snooker to the ones with experience x

Terry Griffiths, WS coach and World Champion apparently advocates wet blocking. Geoff Large, Riley's fitter. I'll take both their advice and go the mid way with misting. Wisdom is a fine thing.

[pottr]

Wet or Dry?

Geoff Large - 40 years fitting experience, I'll take his advice.

You used to sing delicious ballads, pal. Leave snooker to the ones with experience x

[barrywhite]

Never ever ever add water to the cloth. Too much moisture in a cloth can turn chalk into a paste and when it dries the cumulative affect will turn the cloth brittle and it will wear quicker.

It might seem like a short term benefit, as a wet cloth will slide a bit more, but the long term damage offsets that benefit.

You don't leave it wet lad, you iron it twice afterwards so that it's not only dry but warm, i.e. less moisture than when you started. As for wear and tear, even a 6811 TG with light use ain't much good after 12mths, tracking at the pockets can't be avoided.

Not sure about turning chalk into a paste. As you know when the cloth comes off, the chalk is underneath. If you brush the bloth properly before blocking, the should be little chalk on the surface and the surface is where the mist lands.