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  • backhand english

    hi all, i have just been watching a vid showing what is called back hand English,its where you move your cue to put side on the ball by moving the back of your cue,its from an American pool vid. the guy states that using parallel English as we do over here puts more throw on the ball,and is the wrong thing to do. does this only apply to American pool where they use bigger balls, or should we also try it with British pool?:snooker:

  • #2
    here are the vids 1 of 3, http://www.howcast.com/videos/3348-H...-Effects?p=220

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    • #3
      I use backhand english and it work for me better than parallel cuing. The amount of squirt/cueball deflection is decreased. I did compare table length shorts with applying english by both methods. Trick is to find the correct pivot point for your own cue. Generally use intentional english sparingly. Use unintentional english routinely ;-)

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      • #4
        With 4.5" pockets and bigger balls the Americans can afford to use foolishness like this, however we in snooker with 3.5" pockets (mostly) need to drive the cue through straight along the line of aim, compensating for throw when we use 'English' (side spin), learned from experience and practice.

        Also remember, our snooker cloths have a NAP and pool tables do not and that also makes a difference. I would challenge anyone to first aim centre ball for a long pot at snooker and then move the butt of the cue sideways to apply side spin on the cueball and still be able to pot the ball.

        You could on a pool table however you will never pot that ball on a snooker table unless you cheated first and did not line up centre ball on the correct line of aim.

        Before he went to Frank Callan, Doug Mountjoy used to use this method and he was falling away in the rankings. Frank Callan taught him how to offset the cue properly when using side spin (along with a few other faults) and the next season Doug won the UK Championships. It's all in Frank Callan's book.

        Terry
        Terry Davidson
        IBSF Master Coach & Examiner

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        • #5
          It's not possible to reduce the deflection by this method, all you would be doing is changing the path/line of aim. Why add another variable to your mechanics? get a low deflection shaft if you don't want to have to compensate.

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          • #6
            Excuse me, but how can you cue exactly parallel to the centre ball line of aim with side spin and expect to pot the ball? Cue ball will deflect at least a little no matter what cue you're using.

            I agree that first lining up centre and then moving cue sideways while down in stance position to apply spin is awkward and introduces just another variable. Even some good players use it, yes, but it is common misconception that all pool players use it. This is simply not true. Most of the good ones are already lined up correctly with side when down in stance and then don't do or need any additional compensations. Guys like Souquet or Immonen don't any adjustments while down in stance. I've seen top European pool players play in person many times...many of them use almost snooker like approach to shooting, very disciplined.

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            • #7
              Snooker vs American Pool

              Deflection plays a much more important role in american pool than it does in snooker. This is due to the size of the balls and the difference in the cues, making the cues have more deflection. I am a 9 ball player and i use backhand english. There is no difference in the amount of deflection, its just a way of lining up the shot. I condider parallel movement to be a calculated method (or guessing, depending how good you are) and backhand english to be a 'feel' method, and is something that you will do naturally, or not at all. I dont think you should be adjusting whilst over a shot so to play with side you need to walk into a shot lined up correctly allowing for deflection.

              Snooker cues i feel have much less deflection. I think this is due to a number of things, ball size/weight, shaft taper and the lower mass at the end of the cue. The nap on the cloth and the tighter pockets give much less margin for error.

              I would just advise you to pick a method that feels right to you, stick to it, and above all else practice it.

              Good Luck.

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              • #8
                thanks for the info guys,i play British 8 ball. i will experiment a bit with this, and see what happens.

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                • #9
                  I don't see it as "foolishness" just because it is not the way anyone in particular has been taught, or teaches. I tried it and didn't like it a few years ago, but many people say it helps them, so how can it be foolish? Not practical? Maybe, but if it helps, anyone, well, there it is.
                  Renegade_56

                  Mike Wooldridge Black Shark

                  Raffle For Chris Nitti Custom Pool Cue

                  www.classifiedbillards.com/mybb

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                  • #10
                    When I was playing regularly many years ago, I got into this habit and in the end it ruined my cue action. It took quite some time to get out of this habit and get back to where I used to be. Only wish that had never got into this habit and do not really know how it started.
                    Just one of those things.
                    :snooker:

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                    • #11
                      renegade:

                      I think it's 'foolish' to add another moving dimension to the cue action if a player wants to improve. Moving the butt sideways AFTER the player has chosen his aiming point means he also must shift his body to compensate for the aim-off. He is also moving after he is down on the table.

                      In pool this may not matter too much with the smaller table and more forgiving pockets but it would be a disaster with snooker, especially when attempting a long pot where even a millimeter of body movement will cost you the pot. Here, we're talking about moving the tip somewhere around 7 or 8 millimeters (or more) off the line of aim.

                      Terry
                      Terry Davidson
                      IBSF Master Coach & Examiner

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                      • #12
                        I do agree that moving whilst down on a shot is not a good thing, but that isn't just relating to backhand english, its the same for any method of applying side, as applying any side needs an adjustment. I must say, i use backhand english and dont need to adjust my position. Before amyone chips in, yes i still pot the balls.

                        The only way to avoid this issue is to not use side at all. The simple fact that players (good ones anyway) do play with side, illustrates the fact that you have to pick a system that you like and practice with it until its second nature, otherwise just hit every shot plain ball and see what position you are left in.

                        Graeme

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