World Seniors Championship

[DeanH]

Doesn't seem like White entered it this year?

3pm today against D.Dale

[jwinsor]

For me the key is nostalgia....if you're good enough to be a current player, you have no business entering the seniors, in my view. Bear in mind that Fred Davis was a world championship semi-finalist at the age of 64, and Cliff Wilsons entire professional career was as a senior......it's complicated.

I'd make qualification for the seniors in three parts. 1) Over a certain age. 2) A certain time must have passed since appearing in the main draw in a professional tournament. 3) Qualification based on professional tournament success.

The idea would be to encourage the likes of Steve Davis to play, and to discourage the likes of (no offense intended, mike Hallet and Anthony Hamilton).

....or rather, perhaps rebrand and have different tournament structures. Have an age band open to all tournament, but have a more restrictively qualified 'legends' tour/senior comp. We know there is a market for that......

would a handicapped system work or is that something not done ?

[tetricky]

would a handicapped system work or is that something not done ?

I think it's problematic, and potentially meaningless for a pro.
Their skill level is such that they can make a chance and clear the table. What meaningful handicap are you going to give that evens the playing field between a ROS and a Dennis Taylor? How would that look? They could give me a hundred, and they'd probably beat me every time.

Once you add qualifications restrictions (and I include a 'seniors' age limit in that), I think you have to accept it becomes about entertainment, more than serious competition. An opportunity for the fans to see their hero's of yesteryear, rather than the best player on the planet that week winning a serious tournament.

It's an opportunity to build a more structured entertainment/exhibition type environment, with the opportunity for a wider audience to revisit memories of former glory.

[jwinsor]

I think it's problematic, and potentially meaningless for a pro.
Their skill level is such that they can make a chance and clear the table. What meaningful handicap are you going to give that evens the playing field between a ROS and a Dennis Taylor? How would that look? They could give me a hundred, and they'd probably beat me every time.

Once you add qualifications restrictions (and I include a 'seniors' age limit in that), I think you have to accept it becomes about entertainment, more than serious competition. An opportunity for the fans to see their hero's of yesteryear, rather than the best player on the planet that week winning a serious tournament.

It's an opportunity to build a more structured entertainment/exhibition type environment, with the opportunity for a wider audience to revisit memories of former glory.

yes I see your point, maybe a game handicap ROS needs 7 Dennis Taylor needs 3 or 4 ? I really don't know how they can level the field ?

[lesedwards]

They should make it that you have to be 50 or over.

The Seniors has become a disgrace, I went through the draw a week ago and never looked back. Where is Davis, Taylor, Thorburn and the rest of the good old boys. Cliff called me Friday night to talk about my game and a tournament I was playing in on Saturday and I mentioned the seniors. His first comment was not many of the old guys playing as there is not much sense with main stream tour players playing. I think the whole thing backfired as they brought on a big sponsor and the biggest draw in the game declined. " The Rocket" looks good on Barry Hearn. Can you image the Champions tour dropping the age to 40 and the likes of Phil and the boys playing. Come on bump the age back up to 50 and leave it there.

[DeanH]

The Seniors has become a disgrace, I went through the draw a week ago and never looked back. Where is Davis, Taylor, Thorburn and the rest of the good old boys. Cliff called me Friday night to talk about my game and a tournament I was playing in on Saturday and I mentioned the seniors. His first comment was not many of the old guys playing as there is not much sense with main stream tour players playing. I think the whole thing backfired as they brought on a big sponsor and the biggest draw in the game declined. " The Rocket" looks good on Barry Hearn. Can you image the Champions tour dropping the age to 40 and the likes of Phil and the boys playing. Come on bump the age back up to 50 and leave it there.

totally agree, should be over 50 and not a main tour player

[Les, without going off topic or go to another thread, how did you do at the tournament?]

[bolton-cueman]

totally agree, should be over 50 and not a main tour player

[Les, without going off topic or go to another thread, how did you do at the tournament?]

the problem with that is would you actually even half fill The Guild Hall if you had Bob Chaperon v David Taylor or Patsy Fagan v Mike Hallett?

They've brought the 40 something pros in to sell it to TV and to the sponsors.

If you ruled out the current tour pros, you wouldn't be seeing it all...

[lesedwards]

totally agree, should be over 50 and not a main tour player

[Les, without going off topic or go to another thread, how did you do at the tournament?]

Hi Dean I dont want to change the subject on here but I just posted on my thread. Very exciting.
http://www.thesnookerforum.co.uk/boa...294#post872294

[lesedwards]

the problem with that is would you actually even half fill The Guild Hall if you had Bob Chaperon v David Taylor or Patsy Fagan v Mike Hallett?

They've brought the 40 something pros in to sell it to TV and to the sponsors.

If you ruled out the current tour pros, you wouldn't be seeing it all...

Well I guess we all have our thoughts on what the seniors should be made of. First the past World Champions are invited then others try to qualify. Steve Davis vs Hendry or Cliff vs Denis Taylor, now those are matches the audience wants to see in my opinion.

[DeanH]

the problem with that is would you actually even half fill The Guild Hall if you had Bob Chaperon v David Taylor or Patsy Fagan v Mike Hallett?

They've brought the 40 something pros in to sell it to TV and to the sponsors.

If you ruled out the current tour pros, you wouldn't be seeing it all...

yep totally understood, but I do think some of the old -non-tour players would put bums on seats
at least have non-main tour stipulation, that is just not fair

Hi Dean I dont want to change the subject on here but I just posted on my thread. Very exciting.
http://www.thesnookerforum.co.uk/boa...294#post872294

yep, already noticed and replied

[tetricky]

Not sure how, or if, it could be made to work...

...I'm thinking that each ranking tournament (and maybe non-ranking too?) could have a seniors play-off from former champions or/plus invitees, attached to the tournament. The qualifiers from these tournaments go through to meet pre-qualified legends (world champions, uk champions, or some combination of the two) in an end of season seniors world championship.

It needs a structure, and to be tied into the professional game (but noticeably different from it)....not just a sort of arbitrary one off, held in a morgue with no facilities.

[lesedwards]

Not sure how, or if, it could be made to work...

...I'm thinking that each ranking tournament (and maybe non-ranking too?) could have a seniors play-off from former champions or/plus invitees, attached to the tournament. The qualifiers from these tournaments go through to meet pre-qualified legends (world champions, uk champions, or some combination of the two) in an end of season seniors world championship.

It needs a structure, and to be tied into the professional game (but noticeably different from it)....not just a sort of arbitrary one off, held in a morgue with no facilities.

Good ideas. Well said

[itsnoteasy]

Maybe the trouble with senior events is they only attract the age group that watched them in their pomp, not so much Hendry, Davis or Cliff etc, but the lesser names( sorry didn't want to use that phrase but couldn't think of a better one) they just won't bring the casual or younger fans out to watch them so the audiences will always be limited.

[bolton-cueman]

id much rather see Reardon take on Patsy Fagan and Davis take on Dennis, Cliff v Kirk etc rather than see a miss match of Mark Williams or Milkins take on John Parrott.

But, Sky wouldnt entertain it, def not giving them a full weekend of coverage

[SnookerFan]

I've had Hamilton vs Morgan on.

It's the first of it I've had in all weekend.