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Idea for referees putting the balls back correctly

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  • #16
    Originally Posted by jrc750 View Post
    Ronnie potted a red but the cue ball ended up in the pack of reds and left himself snookered on all colours, he chose the black, & he only just missed, but cue ball had to be replaced and for whatever reason the ref couldn't quite get it right. Ronnie wasn't happy but instead of helping out by saying move it a smidge over or whatever he decided to have a go saying "it's not my job to replace it"
    I think the ref should of told him straight, either help out or play from here, i'm in charge not you !!
    Against higgins? What frame was it in? Not the first time he's had run ins with refs.

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    • #17
      Originally Posted by narl View Post
      Against higgins? What frame was it in? Not the first time he's had run ins with refs.
      I think it was against Hawkins back on Monday night ??

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      • #18
        Originally Posted by jrc750 View Post
        I think the ref should of told him straight, either help out or play from here, i'm in charge not you !!
        But as many others have already said, it's up to the ref and his assistant to decide where the balls go. The ref could have rightly asserted his authority and told O'Sullivan the ball had been replaced to his own satisfaction, but he could hardly insist Ronnie helps him out.

        It frustrates me no end when a ref struggles to replace a single ball. It's not rocket science.
        "Kryten, isn't it round about this time of year that your head goes back to the lab for retuning?"

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        • #19
          IMO, the easiest way to do it, would be to give the refs a tablet. When the balls need to be replaced, they overlay the two images:
          (1) where the balls were originally
          (2) their current positions

          It's then very easy for the ref to hold the tablet, and then move the ball carefully until it completely covers the ball in their overlayed image.

          This is kind of what they do now with the markers trying to tell the ref where to put them. So, just cut out the middle man: the ref picks up the tablet, looks at the two images, and puts the balls back perfectly as they were with a screen right in front of his or her eyes.

          It's easy for them to send this feed to the tablet...the current live view, with the positions just before the miss on screen as well.

          WPBSA Level 2 - 1st4Sport Coach
          Available for personalised one-to-one coaching sessions
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          Contact: steve@bartonsnooker.co.uk
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          • #20
            Idea for referees putting the balls back correctly

            "tablet" I chatted with a top referee at Welsh Open last year about the use of a tablet that they can bring to the table, he said it had been discussed and tested but the gloves hinder a slick operation.
            Who knows, it may come back as I think it could be the way to go.
            Also many years ago I said on TSF that a system of laser/light to project directly onto the bed should be possible
            as said above it probably cost a lot to develop and probably "hire".
            even the system they have now costs WS hence it is not available on every table.
            I do think that some referees do rely on the current system a bit too much
            Up the TSF!

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            • #21
              Originally Posted by Billy View Post

              It frustrates me no end when a ref struggles to replace a single ball. It's not rocket science.
              It pretty much is when youre talking about a game where fractions of a mm can mean a ball goes or doesn't, or you can hit a ball or not.

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              • #22
                I guess you could have overlays and all sorts of electronic freeze data to help the Ref to replace the balls after ball put back. Maybe the worry is how far do you go? Already the ref can call on the booth guys to assist in telling where the balls were and just go from there. Yes, its not very exact and bit sloppy, but thats how the game always was- subjective at times. Same with "best to the players ability" when negotiating out of a snooker. Ref has to make calls on how good a player is. On TV at the highest level, it seems unless you hit the ball, miss is called 99% of the time.
                They probably want to resist to much "help" to the ref or why have him out there- just let a robot or "eye" in the sky do it all and probably will one day as things get automated so much as now we see. Anyway, the whole miss and pit back and all that is always a nightmare for ref and players, sad as its such a precise game and hopefully will live into the future as people move away from these sports towards "computers" and all that offers now. hmm...

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                • #23
                  I have noticed that referees do not seem to have a consistent form of hand signals indicting the movement of the ball required; this makes for delay as well with all the "do you mean this way?"
                  Have a "highway code of hand signals for markers/referees"
                  Hand pointing up - "away from the marker" (towards baulk as seen on TV)
                  Hand pointing down - "towards the marker"
                  Hand left/right - in that direction.
                  Hand stays in position - continue to move the ball.

                  Palm towards the referee - stop, done.

                  Up the TSF!

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                  • #24
                    Originally Posted by DeanH View Post
                    I have noticed that referees do not seem to have a consistent form of hand signals indicting the movement of the ball required; this makes for delay as well with all the "do you mean this way?"
                    Have a "highway code of hand signals for markers/referees"
                    Hand pointing up - "away from the marker" (towards baulk as seen on TV)
                    Hand pointing down - "towards the marker"
                    Hand left/right - in that direction.
                    Hand stays in position - continue to move the ball.

                    Palm towards the referee - stop, done.

                    Do you help jumbo jets park at your local airport DeanH 

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                    • #25
                      Originally Posted by jrc750 View Post
                      Do you help jumbo jets park at your local airport DeanH 
                      I don't, a friend works at Heathrow though - maybe he can get me a set of those marshalling paddles
                      Up the TSF!

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                      • #26
                        Originally Posted by DeanH View Post
                        I don't, a friend works at Heathrow though - maybe he can get me a set of those marshalling paddles
                        Ha ha ha that's exactly what I was picturing 😅

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                        • #27
                          This conversation has had a few go rounds. One of the times that it was discussed, my suggestion was not well received (other than by one person).
                          Why not make full use of the ball marker the referee already has. All he would have to do is mark the cue balls’ original location. The guess work in replacing the ball would be eliminated. This could even be done for a ball that is close to the ball on.
                          People replied that all this marking would slow the players’ rhythm down. It would take all of maybe 5 seconds to mark a ball. When there is a disagreement on the placement of the ball, how much time does that take?

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                          • #28
                            I have noticed that many of the ball markers most of the refs have do not have the marking slot!
                            Up the TSF!

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                            • #29
                              All they would have to do is draw a line on it. If they wanted to be creative, take a dremel tool and put a notch on the flat side. This notch would then be used to mark the placement of the ball.

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                              • #30
                                Originally Posted by Mike P View Post
                                All they would have to do is draw a line on it. If they wanted to be creative, take a dremel tool and put a notch on the flat side. This notch would then be used to mark the placement of the ball.
                                there you go, simples
                                Up the TSF!

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