2018 UK Championship

[Le Ball Sack]

Kind of amazing Hendry won his 18 crowns within a 10 year span.

[Mark187187]

I'm a big Hendry fan. He was so dominant, much like Davis. In terms of overall quality, ROS takes it for me based on pure talent. Still prefer Hendry though, such a professional. Actually just got through his autobiography on audiobook which he narrates. Can highly recommend.

[vilkrang]

I think the argument that The 90s was an easier era is unquestionable when you look at the scoring stats. Most journeymen score more heavily now than most top 16 players did in the 90s.

That’s not to say that peak Hendry wouldn’t be successful now though. But I think you’d be looking at three or four world titles rather than seven.

Higgins, Ronnie, Williams and more recently Selby have raised the standard but that doesn’t mean that there are dozens of players as good as Hendry. But there are more players around who on their day could cause an upset and beat him, and this was not the case in the 90s.

There won’t ever be a player as dominant as him again though.

[Odrl]

I think the argument that The 90s was an easier era is unquestionable when you look at the scoring stats. Most journeymen score more heavily now than most top 16 players did in the 90s.

That may be true, but I think you'll find that those same journeymen are scoring more heavily now than they did themselves when they were younger. Are they getting better with age, or is it simply down to conditions making it easier for players to score heavily now compared to 20 years ago?

[arsalanjami]

They were making the comparisons on Eurosport and Jimmy said that he lost 4 finals ..and 2 of them he should have won. IF for arguments sake Jimmy had won say 2...for Hendry it would have been 5 instead of 7?

So really we should blame Jimmy for not winning the Worlds - otherwise Ronnie would be GOAT on all records...haha Jimmyyy!

In all seriousness - Ronnie is the GOAT now undoubtedly for me.

[Mark187187]

Jimmy is full of it. Should have won is nonsense. Not saying he didn't have the talent to deserve a world title or two, but he didn't because he couldn't hold himself together.

Not sure about standards in the 90's were significantly lower at the top. Hendry, Higgins, Williams and ROS all playing great stuff. Maybe strength in depth is the difference and that skews the stats. To be so dominant when the class of '93 where playing so well says alot for Hendry. In terms of longevity, ROS trumps them all, and to still be reaching such high standards really sets him apart.

[Billy]

Jimmy is full of it. Should have won is nonsense. Not saying he didn't have the talent to deserve a world title or two, but he didn't because he couldn't hold himself together.

But if someone claims they should have won, that's their admittance they didn't have what it takes. I don't quite know what you're suggesting here. Yes he bottled it on a couple of occasions, but is that not precisely what he's admitting when he says he 'should' have won?

Your comment suggests he's making excuses for having never won the WC, but I don't recall him ever making such excuses. Saying you 'should' have won is not an excuse - it's an admittance the opportunity was there, but that you failed to take it.

[Mark187187]

I meant in the context that he is suggesting Hendry didn't earn his 7 world titles on merit. I know Jimmy and ROS are good friends, but he can't rewrite history to diminish Hendrys achievements and say that Ronnie's 5 titles is in some way equal. It's nonsense.

[arsalanjami]

That is precisely how Jimmy meant it. I don't think it was an excuse - but just his perception of what happened in the game and his own "lack of".

My point was that Hendry could have easily been at 5 worlds had Jimmy not bottled it...BUT Hendry still had to pot the balls and win so completely earned it.


Hendry reigned for a decade while O Sullivan for 3 (on and off). I hate making these comparisons.

I just love the way Hendry played the game. What a legend.

[blahblah01]

The point is why Hendry's reign ended and it is because the game changed, just as much as he changed it and S Davis before.

S Davis was the first real Pro, ie dedication, practice and the whole Percentage Snooker stuff, which was too much for the bods from the '70's.

Hendry took that professionalism and used it with an "if I can see it, I'll pot it" attitude which was too much for Davis - who has said the main reason he quit was that he could not score as heavily as the kids. Some couod argue that he was a bit Cliff wilson before the very thinck glasses, hearing aid(s) etc :wink:

Williams, Higgins and ROS (who has moved from the Hendry end to the centre, with the Reardon Years) emerged in various positions along that spectrum ie safety\matchplay and clinical Hendryesque clearances. They were not alone with the likes of Hunter, Stevens et al: while each end was represented ie Dott, Ebdon and the Essex mafia for Davis and Lee, Murphy et al for Hendry.

Tossing in Selby to the same school as Higgins ie a battling matchplayer who can clear up would be another for Hendry to beat by "just potting".

So while he completely redefined Snooker, his inabilty to evolve with it led to his demise, and arguably why Murphy and the younger players (inc the Chinese) struggle. Obviously that means that I wouldn't rate his chances at Sheffield of beating two of Selby, ROS and Williams when he was bothered, and even Hawkins could have been tricky.

[Odrl]

So while he completely redefined Snooker, his inabilty to evolve with it led to his demise, and arguably why Murphy and the younger players (inc the Chinese) struggle. Obviously that means that I wouldn't rate his chances at Sheffield of beating two of Selby, ROS and Williams when he was bothered, and even Hawkins could have been tricky.

Just to state the obvious, Hendry did beat O'Sullivan and Williams over four sessions to win the 1999 World title, and also beat Hunter, Wattana and Stevens earlier in the tournament. But of course getting through that kind of draw successfully seven times would be a big ask for any player, past or present.

[Mark187187]

I'd pick Hendry in his prime against Hawkins, Selby and Williams all day long. I'd probably rate Hendry to win about 40% against O'Sullivan, probably closer in longer format. I'd bet on him against Higgins too. I think the gap in class is really overstated, he won 5 of his world titles 1993 onwards when all of these players except Selby were active, and beat them up plenty, even up to 2012 when he was deep in decline and had lost control of his right arm. He gave world no 1 Higgins a good drubbing in the 2012 World Championship as well as hitting a 147 earlier. That's a good tournament for most players, but for him it was so far below his talent he retired.

Let's not pretend when talking about GOAT that there are any more than 2 options

[Billy]

Okay I give in. What does GOAT stand for?

I meant in the context that he is suggesting Hendry didn't earn his 7 world titles on merit. I know Jimmy and ROS are good friends, but he can't rewrite history to diminish Hendrys achievements and say that Ronnie's 5 titles is in some way equal. It's nonsense.

I didn't see the interview. Is this what he was suggesting, or is it just how you're reading it?

[blahblah01]

Greatert of All Time

[blahblah01]

I'd pick Hendry in his prime against Hawkins, Selby and Williams all day long. I'd probably rate Hendry to win about 40% against O'Sullivan, probably closer in longer format. I'd bet on him against Higgins too. I think the gap in class is really overstated, he won 5 of his world titles 1993 onwards when all of these players except Selby were active, and beat them up plenty, even up to 2012 when he was deep in decline and had lost control of his right arm. He gave world no 1 Higgins a good drubbing in the 2012 World Championship as well as hitting a 147 earlier. That's a good tournament for most players, but for him it was so far below his talent he retired.

Let's not pretend when talking about GOAT that there are any more than 2 options

True, I never intended that he could never beat them etc, but to win so many WC's with them in full flow would would have been a bigger challenge than White in the Final...