Antique Ivory Billiard Balls once used by Tom Reece in world record break

[ADR147]

It is legal to buy and sell pre 1947 ivory, there is a cue making website in the US that does so, but cannot now sell it overseas or to Florida as that state has recently changed the law. So in the US in all states bar Florida you can buy and sell pre 1947 ivory, though proving it's age isn't easy, hence the change in the law. I believe that most of the illegal stuff there comes from walrus tusks.

Those billiard balls, if genuine, can be worth an awful lot to the right person, Roger Lee maybe.

It is not quite as simple as that, you have to have a licence technically. As for ivory balls people stopped using them because they found something better, I don't think we should ignore the mistakes of the past, otherwise you end up like Americans pretending they are not racists.

[jonny66]

It is not quite as simple as that, you have to have a licence technically. As for ivory balls people stopped using them because they found something better, I don't think we should ignore the mistakes of the past, otherwise you end up like Americans pretending they are not racists.

I don't want to open up another can of worms here, but WS say they use Amarith TC balls because they are the closest thing to Ivory that is available. So when you say they found something better do you mean easier/cheaper to make?

[DeanH]

Antique Ivory Billiard Balls once used by Tom Reece in world record break

j66 - not seen WS saying they use Aramith because they are close to ivory, do you have any link for this?
I think they use Aramith because that was the firm that gave the best commercial offer than anyone else; not that there was any other firm really after Aramith bought the rights to BCE composite balls in the 70s (?).
Back when ivory balls where still available and composite balls started appearing there were several makes available, and often it was the ball manufacturer that would supply their balls for a tournament under approval from the governing body (BA&CC). So you would see adverts for tournaments clearly stating which balls were going to be used.
Even now WPBSA do not stipulate the make and material of the balls,only the size and range of weight for the set.

[jonny66]

Don't have a link, sorry, it was just something on the BBC during the Worlds, one of those mid-session interval things they put on about the balls they use. I think I meant Phenolic Resin when I said Amarith.

[itsnoteasy]

Don't have a link, sorry, it was just something on the BBC during the Worlds, one of those mid-session interval things they put on about the balls they use. I think I meant Phenolic Resin when I said Amarith.

I remember that Jonny, you are correct.

[DeanH]

Don't have a link, sorry, it was just something on the BBC during the Worlds, one of those mid-session interval things they put on about the balls they use. I think I meant Phenolic Resin when I said Amarith.

Yep I took phenolic as Aramith
I remember the film of the guy from Thurston's museum discussing balls and the different makes and materials. All of them had to have similar playing characteristics to the old ivory, not just Aramith and their phenolic resin.
During the 60s and 70s there were several materials and different suppliers used through all the events. Until basically Aramith was the only (European) manufacturer left for WS to choose from.

[ADR147]

Ivory was always unstable.

[DeanH]

Ivory was always unstable.

The same film mentioned above mentioned that the ivory balls would be sent away to be ground back to spherical, obviously this process would remove material so the governing body had a minimum size allowed. If a ball was smaller than this stipulated size they were not allowed to be used... this minimum size is what we have as our only size now 2 1/16" :biggrin:

[itsnoteasy]

Yep I took phenolic as Aramith
I remember the film of the guy from Thurston's museum discussing balls and the different makes and materials. All of them had to have similar playing characteristics to the old ivory, not just Aramith and their phenolic resin.
During the 60s and 70s there were several materials and different suppliers used through all the events. Until basically Aramith was the only (European) manufacturer left for WS to choose from.

Oh, it might have been that I remember Dean

[DeanH]

Oh, it might have been that I remember Dean

There are two films that I remember, one with Steve Davis at the Thurston museum with the curator, and another with a BBC commentator at one of the practise tables at the Worlds with the same bloke from Thurston.

[DeanH]

Antique Ivory Billiard Balls once used by Tom Reece in world record break

Back in the early 1900s they knew that ivory was a finite supply so there was a reward of a large amount of money (for that time) for anyone to develop a new material for billiard/snooker/pool balls to replace ivory with same playing characteristics as ivory. Hence there were many new materials and brands that came to the market.

[itsnoteasy]

There are two films that I remember, one with Steve Davis at the Thurston museum with the curator, and another with a BBC commentator at one of the practise tables at the Worlds with the same bloke from Thurston.

It's definitely the second one I can remember , I'm sure the fact that the PR balls were similar to Ivory was mentioned in it and as Jonny said it was shown as some kind of mid session filler.

[Big Splash!]

I don't want to open up another can of worms here, but WS say they use Amarith TC balls because they are the closest thing to Ivory that is available. So when you say they found something better do you mean easier/cheaper to make?

Not quite true but close. Aramith say that phenolic resin is the closest in behaviour to ivory of any plastic including super crystallate, of which they also own the patent after they took over their main rival in Europe. The WPBSA awarded Aramith sole supplier status. The reasons for this are complex but the fact they they make the best plastic ball ever is one.

So yeah, if Aramith need to get close to ivory, they need to keep a few balls. Them and snooker museums. Private collectors don't, as they have no good reason.

C'mon VMax, start the argument then, SC kicks less than ivory, bone, TCs, space dust, nylon... :biggrin-new:

[Big Splash!]

Ivory was always unstable.

Not as unstable as early crystallate balls, they caught fire and blew up.

[jonny66]

My balls once caught fire, and blew up. That was a bad day