Table cloth selection..

[Cue crafty]

IMO, personally, it's not necessarily easier, it's the inherent change to a game that doesn't need it.

[Cue crafty]

Bang on INE!

[jonny66]

So why do they shave the nap off the cloth for pro tournaments? Do you agree with that or do you think it should be back on?

[Cue crafty]

So why do they shave the nap off the cloth for pro tournaments? Do you agree with that or do you think it should be back on?

Not keen personally, but understand that it creates optimum conditions for a pro to take advantage of. I guess that may be good for TV, but would you invent a better surface for a table tennis table?

[jonny66]

Not keen personally, but understand that it creates optimum conditions for a pro to take advantage of. I guess that may be good for TV, but would you invent a better surface for a table tennis table?

Of course I would, what's wrong with things getting better? Do you travel by horse and cart?

[dinovirus]

Why would you want to make the game easier?

Because it's hard enough to get young people playing it as it is.

At the national snooker championship last year the average age was probably 42 or 43. Kids who do get into billiard sports are almost exclusively starting in pool and staying there. Why? Because it's simply more fun to play on those tables. They miss less and the tables play a nice speed all the time, which is also more fun. Snooker of course is where the big money is, but for a lot of the players over here that all seems like a million miles away. As a result it's getting harder and harder to even find tables, never mind good competition.

As for the rest of your arguments you'd have a point if the snooker cloth was a better product but it's just not. Simonis is better in every way.

[vmax4steve]

So why do they shave the nap off the cloth for pro tournaments? Do you agree with that or do you think it should be back on?

Because when the change to phenolic rersin balls was forced on the WPBSA it was found they kicked like crazy on the regular napped cloths. In order to lessen the kicks the nap was shaved, shaved again and shaved again to decrease the resistance between the balls. Table heaters were introduced for the same reason but even now when there is increased moisture in the air the kicks spoil the game.

This of course has made the game easier and the tons and maxi's have rocketed up.

Because it's hard enough to get young people playing it as it is.

At the national snooker championship last year the average age was probably 42 or 43. Kids who do get into billiard sports are almost exclusively starting in pool and staying there. Why? Because it's simply more fun to play on those tables. They miss less and the tables play a nice speed all the time, which is also more fun.

Nothing to do with fun, all to do with the 'no one is allowed to fail' culture in our education system. Everything has been dumbed down to the extent that talent is no longer a pre-requisite to success.
The beauty of snooker is that, although it is easier than it was due to faster cloths, it's still a very difficult game that cannot be mastered.

What sport needs are rules that mean the basics cannot be altered, then we can compare eras, but when conditions change for the better then how can we. Lighter balls in football, faster cloths in snooker, bigger rackets in tennis, larger heads for golf clubs along with special dimpled balls that fly straighter and mowers that cut the genetically modified grass strains on the green closer, and all sold to you in HD super slo mo and endless vaccuous analysis from so called experts and pundits.

Bollocks to the young people who fear to fail, they can stay in pool and leave snooker to those of us who strive.

[Hello, Mr Big Shot]

Because when the change to phenolic rersin balls was forced on the WPBSA it was found they kicked like crazy on the regular napped cloths. In order to lessen the kicks the nap was shaved, shaved again and shaved again to decrease the resistance between the balls. Table heaters were introduced for the same reason but even now when there is increased moisture in the air the kicks spoil the game.

This of course has made the game easier and the tons and maxi's have rocketed up.




Nothing to do with fun, all to do with the 'no one is allowed to fail' culture in our education system. Everything has been dumbed down to the extent that talent is no longer a pre-requisite to success.
The beauty of snooker is that, although it is easier than it was due to faster cloths, it's still a very difficult game that cannot be mastered.

What sport needs are rules that mean the basics cannot be altered, then we can compare eras, but when conditions change for the better then how can we. Lighter balls in football, faster cloths in snooker, bigger rackets in tennis, larger heads for golf clubs along with special dimpled balls that fly straighter and mowers that cut the genetically modified grass strains on the green closer, and all sold to you in HD super slo mo and endless vaccuous analysis from so called experts and pundits.

Bollocks to the young people who fear to fail, they can stay in pool and leave snooker to those of us who strive.

Lol. You strivers can keep the game then - all three of you.

[Terry Davidson]

vmax:

It has nothing to do with 'no one is allowed to fail' thing going on in the educational system. It's because youngsters can pot balls on pool tables with 4.5" pockets a lot quicker than they can on a traditional snooker table with pockets slightly less than 3.5". They can get a sense of achievement a lot sooner with pool.

In addition almost all of the great pros from the 80's learned on loose tables and I suspect some of the modern day pros learned on more generous tables too along with better conditions. If a snooker club wants to increase their business they should let out their pockets a bit and keep them in good shape and soon all the players will be playing there because they will be getting higher breaks.

I know you're a traditionalist and enjoy tight pockets and slow tables and playing in an unheated club in your thick sweater(s) but at some point we all have to realize snooker is in competition with other sports and interests and we all collectively have to do something because we are losing that battle big time.

OK, rant over.

[itsnoteasy]

So why do they shave the nap off the cloth for pro tournaments? Do you agree with that or do you think it should be back on?

No I don't agree with the cloths they play on, as I said there is a very reasonable stand to make that says the game should be harder for the pros not easier. I would do away with table heaters as well, no need for them.
If Steve Davis and Judd Trump say 6811 TG is just as, if not faster than tv cloths, on an unheated table, what's the point in tv cloths and heaters?Are they just a gimmick?
There is nothing wrong with things getting better, that's a completely different argument than making things easier. Stopping kicks, is making things better, bigger pockets are making things easier, I have no problems with making things better. If this cloth makes things easier as has been claimed, I'm not for it, learn how to play the game properly and stop looking for excuses( not you personally, I'm mean all of us as amateur snookerists) that's why I play, I want it to mean something, I don't need the game degraded and degraded until im good at it, I want to improve and match my ability to the game.

[Geoff Large]

I remember back in the 1980s when in football they tried to enforce artificial grass onto us , saying that football matches will not be called of and in fact it is better to play on , those clubs that did it , Watford or Luton ? was the first they soon went back to grass .

the same comparison with this pool napless cloth being pushed at us is wrong we have played the game of billiards and snooker on napped cloth for decades and why should an Americanized cloth be pushed onto us .
even the majority of UK pool tables are played on napped cloth

keep american type napped cloth on american tables and away from Snooker and Billiards .

We tried playing football on plastic grass just to please someone and that did not work out , so I think the same should be said about napless pool cloth ,c all me old fashioned and traditionalist but tghat's my thoughts .
I do not take kindly to having this cloth forced onto us just because it is good for American pool

It is all down to maintenance keeps a cloth ironed and brushed well and it will play well , a little effort in brushing , even the napless cloth requires the chalk being brushed off .

[philip in china]

You are old fashioned and traditionalist, Geoff.

[itsnoteasy]

You are old fashioned and traditionalist, Geoff.

And that's a good thing, as it usually comes hand in hand with high standards and pride in what you do.

[jamesg19851]

Our match table was reclothed and it's like a brand new table now, maybe the best table in the league and definitely the tightest pockets!

[philip in china]

What cloth did they use?