Martin Gould change of cue action

[Ant147]

Martin Gould change of cue action

I thought that to start with but worth it in the end. If you go on sightright uk.com it will tell you more. He did a bit with terry and Steve Davis. If you do come over, would love to catch up, really like your theories and practices.

[Reptile1]

I think I might invest in one of these!

I guess it is possible to make your own but for coaching others the genuine "sightright" looks the part.

[Terry Davidson]

OK, I tried to make one of my own yesterday with limited success (I'm not very handy), so I checked it out on-line and it would be 35 + 17 shipping to me. Not sure if I want to go for the full 52quid or not but it might be helpful with my students. I know Nic Barrow has one as does Terry Griffiths and they both use it when they coach.

I think I built mine a bit too high so today I will modify it and bring it lower and also try and get the straight lines a little more accurate and see what happens. I know you need a second person there to whip away the paper covering the far line and the student (myself in this case) is supposed to check their initial impression of what they see with the far line. If I can get an accurate one built it should be an interesting experiment, although I think the real one would be much better.

Terry

[damienlch]

is this what you are all talking about?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNLGg...eature=related

Video at 1.40min: "...But the question is, is ROS a better player if he used that board to centrally line himself up or does he see that line correctly straight. I haven't got a clue."

That is so typical Davis humour...

[Stevie]

Lol I liked that too, you expect Steve to say- well, here is the man himself, why don't we ask him and maybe he can show us.....

[Particle Physics]

Video at 1.40min: "...But the question is, is ROS a better player if he used that board to centrally line himself up or does he see that line correctly straight. I haven't got a clue."

That is so typical Davis humour...

Funny thing is, this is exactly what I've been talking about, sorry, droning on about, for ages. Sighting is crucial. A lot of folk on here poo pooed the idea of using dominant eye to sight, but if the best potters are, maybe there's something in it?

[Inoffthered]

Funny thing is, this is exactly what I've been talking about, sorry, droning on about, for ages. Sighting is crucial. A lot of folk on here poo pooed the idea of using dominant eye to sight, but if the best potters are, maybe there's something in it?

Do you have a dominant eye Jerry? or 20/20.

[damienlch]

Funny thing is, this is exactly what I've been talking about, sorry, droning on about, for ages. Sighting is crucial. A lot of folk on here poo pooed the idea of using dominant eye to sight, but if the best potters are, maybe there's something in it?

I'd experimented sighting with my dominant eye some time ago. Didn't work out though. I found that it is not as easy as running the cue under one eye. I have to adjust my approach and alignment to the shot and I just can't get it right. May work well for some folks but I don't think it's a one size fits all...

[Terry Davidson]

I may get some arguments about this...Don't confuse AIMING with SIGHTING.

AIMING is done when standing up behind the shot. SIGHTING is done when you're down on the shot and you look along the cue when the cue is still and in the address position (the first pause and the front pause).

If you have a good pre-shot routine, do your AIMING when standing up, and then drop the head STRAIGHT DOWN you will automatically be on the line of aim you've determined when standing up. Now here is where SIGHTING comes in. If you look along the cue when it's still and in the address position you should be CONFIRMING that you are on the line of aim you've selected. To get this confirmation view correct a lot of players feel they should be running the cue under the dominant eye or even somewhere towards the dominant eye and they feel if the player doesn't have this perfect confirmation view then he needs to change his set-up to get the cue in the right spot, which they feel concerns the dominant eye. (I believe it concerns the BALANCE IN VISION between both eyes and the correct alignment is somewhere between the two eyes unless a player is blind in one eye, like Joe Davis).

If a player is getting the wrong information when down on the cue and can't confirm the line of aim correctly the temptation is to shift the hips very slightly either right or left (which will change the alignment of the cue) until he feels he is on the correct line of aim, however this is a big MISTAKE since the view when down on the table is not as accurate as the view when standing behind the shot. This is a very difficult situation to deal with and it's very difficult for these players to NOT adjust their aim when down on the cue. You will even see the pros do this from time to time, especially with pots to blind pockets.

To those people out there who feel it's vital to have the cue more under or directly under the dominant eye I say it's not really necessary if you had the ability to not alter your line of aim when down on the shot. However, I will agree this is very difficult to control and therefore it's much better for the MAJORITY of players to align their cue under their eyes at a point where they get an accurate feed-back loop concerning the correct line of aim.

BUT, you must realize that any re-alignment of the head also entails a re-alignment of the set-up to counterbalance the change so I still insist the best way to get the proper eye alignment is to turn the head ONLY and do not move the cue to the right or left of the chin.

Another BUT...some players might have a pre-existing alignment fault and moving the cue over on the chin may in fact correct this and they will play better since that change on the chin now has them aligned ideally for their delivery.

So, what's the proper way to attack this? I would say get confirmation you are FIRST delivering the cue consistently straight (in itself a VERY difficult thing to master) and then after you have achieved that if you feel what you're seeing when down on the cue is not what you believe is the correct line of aim then go to a device like the 'SightRite' to find your ideal spot but I would warn you should ONLY turn the head, do not alter that good alignment you've already mastered by moving the cue on the chin.

WHATEVER EVER YOU DO THOUGH, DO NOT CHANGE YOUR LINE OF AIM WHEN DOWN ON THE SHOT since you are not getting the best view of the angle of the pot when your eyes are only 10" or so above the table.

(So now I will wait for everyone to climb my frame in disagreement with this, but I'm just sayin'. You can choose to believe me or you can choose to believe whatever you think is the way to go).

Terry

[DeanH]

good post Terry, as usual
Any further thoughts on the SightRight-thingie, the one you made, etc.?

[Terry Davidson]

dean:

The one I made is CRAP...I didn't get the lines perfectly straight and it's too high (I said I was a lousy builder). However, a member on here had a new one he used at first and then packed away and he has sent it to me for just postage which was very kind of him.

I tried my hand-made device but I have a problem in that I had a very successful eye check a few weeks ago at a local university contact lens lab and on the machine they got me to 20/20 with my right eye, and I haven't had clear vision out of that eye for over 5 years now. I will get the contact on Sept 12th and if it works then I will give the actual SightRite device a good trial (the problem being you actually need another person to do it correctly).

I think it will be very interesting, however when I get down on a shot my biggest problem is delivering the damned cue straight. I'm comfortable with what I see when I'm down on the cue and have no temptation to shift my hips to adjust the line of aim so it will also be interesting to see if something changes with this new contact.

I believe this is what the guy flogging the SightRite is doing (my post ^^) however it would be very interesting to me personally to get a couple of hours off him to see and assess the device properly. A little expensive though and I ain't in Britain much.

Terry

[DeanH]

Thanks for the update Terry.
Best of luck with the new contact.
when you get the real item, any update will be appreciated.
cheers

[alabadi]

Just a quick observation Terry, i was lead to believe that once down all you look at is the OB and cueball and not the actual cue.

now saying that i myself can't help looking at the cue especially to check that it is moving in a straight line, but i have read and been told by other coaches not to look at the cue.

one more thing when you say when down you look along the cue to check that you are aiming correctly, i would find this difficult especially on anything less that halfball because the aiming is into thin air and hard to tell.

Alabbadi

[cazmac1]

Martin used to be very open on angle shots,thus being prone to cutting the ball thin. All steve has done is brought into line with the shot. I use Steve Feeney as my coach with the sight right product and it transformed my game. It's all to do with points of aim and contact points. Steve doesn't touch cue action just the way you approach the ball.

Hi Ant147 can you explain what you mean by the term "open" as I suffer from over cutting, especially on soft shots?

[Terry Davidson]

alabadi:

I would disagree with those coaches since I think EVERY player checks the cue alignment when down on the shot and ensures that line of aim will place the cueball on the right spot on the object ball, whether he uses 'ghost ball' or 'BOB' type of aiming since the cue length over the 'V' of the bridge is for sure in his peripheral vision when he's looking at the cueball.

But if you want to prove this to yourself try the following little experiment. Take a piece of paper and fold it into a triangle which is about the height of centre-ball (1" high) and perhaps 3" wide at the base and then set up the cueball anywhere you want and an object ball anywhere you want and before you get down on the shot place this triangle right in front of the cueball on the line of aim so you can cue through the triangle but you won't be able to see the cue at all. I've tried this exercise and proven to myself that even though my eyes flick between CB and OB when I'm feathering, at the initial first pause and also at the front pause my eyes are actually checking from the 'V' to the OB.

This experiment will quickly show you that you do indeed check the line of the cue, hopefully when it's at rest in the address position. Now, I know it's possible to pot with your eyes closed, however the closed-eye exercise requires that the student uses a front pause and then closes the eyes, so he would still be confirming the line of aim from the 'V' of the bridge to the back of the object ball.

Terry