Ssb - selby rules uk

[Rane]

Selby got some run last night but his overall matchplay is first class. When he is off form he plays accordingly and its called a B game, Selby and Higgins use it when needed. The players that have a solid B game are normally the players that make a consistent living out of the game.

O´Sullivan and Williams are two other with a solid B game.

[nrage]

I don't buy this. If you really understand snooker you will know the difference between a grinder like Selby who tries to make frames scrappy and an attacking player like Higgins, that despite his excellent safety he plays the right shot and very few of his matches and frames are scrappy.

Selby plays a very tactical bordering on negative game. He doesn't try to win by attacking the frame, his main aim is to drag the other guys game down so that he has more of a chance of winning those scrappy frames. He does rely on luck a heck of a lot too as throughout this tournament he has probably used up his seasons luck in one or two matches! This is why people don't like his game. I've never known a player so hated, okay Ebdon used to be slow but he was far from negative.

I think you've got Selby's motivations all wrong. It all comes down to shot selection. What you're calling "negative" shot choices are just "more conservative" or "safer" shot choices, they're less risky and consequently not as attacking.

Attacking is great to watch, and all that, but it's always riskier and doesn't always pay off. Balancing attacking and defensive play is the key, and I think Higgins is one of the best. Selby may over emphasize defense perhaps (debatable), but it's hard to argue with his results.

Players who attack too much end up winning some, when the attacking pays off and puts the fear of .. into their opponent, but it can also fall on it's face leaving you another frame behind.

No one likes to play scrappy frames, but everyone likes to win. The difference between a Selby and some other players is that Selby would rather win a frame, even if it's scrappy, than lose. There is nothing wrong with that, snooker is his profession and winning means everything.

[cueman]

All I can say is in every one of Selby's matches this week the majority of frames went scrappy. Now is that purely coincidence or was it a tactic of Selby's? The tables run great these days so conditions couldn't be better, everyone is playing regular snooker so form shouldn't come into it either. So the only conclusion is that Selby is making his matches scrappy, dragging the other guys game down to suit his level and then benefitting from their mistakes as well as relying on a fair amount of luck. Without matches being scrappy this week Selby would not have won one of them.

That is all I am making and I just fail to see how people can't see this.

[147alltheway]

Congrats to Mark Selby on his win. I don't think it was a boring final at all , in fact I found it quite entertaining with all the drama. Both players struggled a little bit at the end but that's just shows how hard it may be to handle the pressure. I realy don't get why Mark get so much critique towards his game as how he plays this game is his own choice and should be respected by fellow players. In my oppinion Selby is a top notch player.

Btw Commiseration to Shaun.

[Odrl]

All I can say is in every one of Selby's matches this week the majority of frames went scrappy. Now is that purely coincidence or was it a tactic of Selby's? The tables run great these days so conditions couldn't be better, everyone is playing regular snooker so form shouldn't come into it either. So the only conclusion is that Selby is making his matches scrappy, dragging the other guys game down to suit his level and then benefitting from their mistakes as well as relying on a fair amount of luck. Without matches being scrappy this week Selby would not have won one of them.

That is all I am making and I just fail to see how people can't see this.

Are there any shots that stick in your mind that were played to make a frame scrappy?

I would say that it went scrappy because Selby wasn't winning frames in one visit. He went for long pots, but then broke down more often than not, as did his opponents.

I'm not saying Selby never does this, it's not unusual to see him playing two or three frames in a row where safety is played at the black end, because a red goes towards baulk. I'm pretty sure he has forced this situation on purpose in the past, and it's actually one of the reasons I like him. :wink: But I don't think that was really the case last week.

[nrage]

All I can say is in every one of Selby's matches this week the majority of frames went scrappy. Now is that purely coincidence or was it a tactic of Selby's? The tables run great these days so conditions couldn't be better, everyone is playing regular snooker so form shouldn't come into it either. So the only conclusion is that Selby is making his matches scrappy, dragging the other guys game down to suit his level and then benefitting from their mistakes as well as relying on a fair amount of luck. Without matches being scrappy this week Selby would not have won one of them.

That is all I am making and I just fail to see how people can't see this.

Again, you're mistaking the motivations (not the outcome). You're assuming that because a frame becomes scrappy, Selby wants/likes it that way - which is just plain wrong.

Selby can, and does win frames in 1 visit, and would always prefer to (he'd be mad not to). So, he obviously doesn't need or want a frame to be scrappy.

Like any other player he needs an opening to win a frame in 1 visit. If his opponent doesn't provide a sufficiently tempting one then he's going to play safe. The only difference between Selby and another player is what they find tempting, or what kind of risk they want to take.

The conservative approach is naturally going to mean more scrappy frames because you're going to pass up the risky openers. It also means you win less frames in 1 visit (because you're less likely to get in early if you pass up openers, and once a frame gets scrappy this gets harder to do). But, it appears that the conservative approach also means you win more matches - going by Selby's recent results.

Ali Carter was playing conservatively in the last WC final against Ronnie. It would probably have won him the final against any other player on any other day. But, Ronnie was just too good (for anyone) that day. There were quite a few scrappy frames in that final, less than there would have been because Ronnie can be very attacking, and because Ronnie can win a scrappy frame in one visit - which not many players can do.

But, still, my basic point is that you're mistaking the intent behind the result, and that conservative shot selection will naturally result in scrappy frames. This does not imply a conservative player wants a scrappy frame.

[Looki]

How a guy who's up there near the top in the centuries per season list wants to make frames scrappy or drag other player down is beyond me. He must have been kicking himself after every ton.

[The Rook]

It was a really awful final by today's standards in terms of quality, but to be fair Selby won the tournament whilst playing nowhere near his best snooker. Not many players can do that, perhaps only John Higgins - and he is one of the greatest players to pick up a cue.

It's about time that certain people put their emotions to one side and gave Selby some sincere credit where it is due. Of course it is possible for a mediocre (lucky) pro to fluke a big win in their career if the conditions are right, but Selby has won 3 snooker majors now, and has had a sustained period at no 1. There are no "good" players who have achieved this - only exceptional ones. Flair isn't the final word when determining the worth of a player.

[alabadi]

I personally think Ali is a better all round player than Selby. You cant honestly think Mark would have stood a chance against Ronnie, Higgins,Trump on last nights performance they would have all wiped the floor with him.

i seem to remember that Selby beat Ronnie in the Masters 2010 when O'Sulivan was 9-6 up Selby won 4 in a row that day to win.

I think that many don't give Selby credit for his hard work and graft, he was world no 1 for 14 months, and only lost it for a month and now he is back at No 1 again.

he deserves everything he gets, its consistency that gets him there not flare.

Alabbadi

[alabadi]

All I can say is in every one of Selby's matches this week the majority of frames went scrappy.
.

Who cares if it was scrappy or not, the main thing is the win, and that's what it comes down to in the end. its like Man U they play to win not entertain and play beautiful football like Arsenal.

its a results industry, no one remembers who came second. in years to come history will show Mark Selby as the UK champion 2012, it won't say he won a scrappy final.

Alabbadi

[cueman]

Who cares if it was scrappy or not, the main thing is the win, and that's what it comes down to in the end. its like Man U they play to win not entertain and play beautiful football like Arsenal.

its a results industry, no one remembers who came second. in years to come history will show Mark Selby as the UK champion 2012, it won't say he won a scrappy final.

Alabbadi

Utd do play to win and entertain, they can't always do it but that is the Utd way. Arsenal aren't any more entertaining, they just try and pass it around like barca except they don't have the quality to do it, they still get results but football can't really compare to snooker in that sense.

All players can knock in century breaks all day long. However the game is about tactics and taking your chances. However this tournament like it or not I've never known a player be so lucky to win, certainly not one of the major events like this. I made a reference about it all the way through the final and he also had massive rubs against Robertson too. The reason the frames went scrappy was largely due to selby missing and coming out lucky which meant his opponent had to play awkward shots to try and get things safe.
Sure the record books will say UK champion Mark Selby, it should also say in brackets, the luckiest ever win!

[The Rook]

i seem to remember that Selby beat Ronnie in the Masters 2010 when O'Sulivan was 9-6 up Selby won 4 in a row that day to win.

I think that many don't give Selby credit for his hard work and graft, he was world no 1 for 14 months, and only lost it for a month and now he is back at No 1 again.

he deserves everything he gets, its consistency that gets him there not flare.

Alabbadi

Yes. He also made similar comebacks against ROS in the Welsh Open final, and the World Championships in 2010. A number of people seem to conveniently forget these incidents, or ludicrously dismiss them as due to Selby's good luck or poor sportsmanship. Anyone who thinks that Selby's career is based on good fortune is only fooling themselves, and completely undermining their own credibility in a very public way. Fortunately few will notice, and even fewer will care.

I think we can all safely say that O'Sullivan at his best would murder Selby's performance in the final yesterday. The catch is that Selby was playing nowhere near his personal best and his B game is probably second only to Higgins.

[alabadi]

I've never known a player be so lucky to win, certainly not one of the major events like this.The reason the frames went scrappy was largely due to selby missing and coming out lucky which meant his opponent had to play awkward shots to try and get things safe.
Sure the record books will say UK champion Mark Selby, it should also say in brackets, the luckiest ever win!

i agree he had some luck when he missed sometimes , but others did too.

its not all down to luck, you don't come from 4-0 down, 3-0 and 4-2 down in three matches without being a very good tactical and talented player, especially when you are playing top quality players like , Robertson, Day and Murphy.

i think he won because he held his nerve when it mattered. Murphy didn't , a good example was the Blue he missed. Murphy had his chances and didn't take them so Selby deserves what he got.

Alabbadi

[Rane]

Maybe it wasn´t the prettiest thing but he won. But if we look back even Hendry, Higgins and O´Sullivan has won titles as well, that they didn´t deserve to win. And by winning two of the three big tournaments he has achieved what very few players actually have done over the years.