Sidespin on a snooker table both with and against the nap

[throtts]

Holy Moly,

I getting confused from some of the above. WTF is going on.

[j6uk]

not read all the above but, if in your book there is no so called throw and its curving onto bob then the white wouldnt hold, if anything it should in theory run on after contact with an angled shot.

j6...to clarify, the cueball is BELOW the black (i.e. - closer to the pink than the top cushion) and you would use RH side to make for a more dead-in shot as at low speed CB throw from RH side to the left gets overtaken by the RH side and CB will hit the black more straight-on. If you hit harder you wouldn't be able to hold the spot as CB would hit the black on the 3/4 point. You have to hit low power, at dead weight to stop the CB.

I think when Travis says the CB is 'high' on the black is where the confusion is. If he is 'high' on the black then the CB is towards the top cushion but because of the TV coverage they say 'below the black' to mean closer to the cushion, and 'high' on the black to mean between black and pink spots. If you are above the black in correct terminology then it would be a cut-back black and LH side is correct but if you are low on the black with correct terminology then it would be RH side.

You have to use what the Americans say is 'inside english' and with the CB 'high' on the black (towards pink spot) it would be RH side as in your video I believe.

For those players who don't know, the top spot was originally what today's black spot in snooker was called and the bottom of the table is the baulk area. That why we call the black pocket the 'top pockets'. The TV commentators always use the wrong terminology I guess to make it easier for the uneducated to follow because the pink look to be above the black on TV.

I doubt there's any real confusion as you know yourself you have to use that 'inside english' to hold the CB and make the pot. What Travis said was he used helping side to hold the CB and that's just wrong.

if its turning onto bob regardless of what side it should make the cb run away after contact, i dont see how you hold the cb wit your theory.
its all getting a bit messy tel

[Terry Davidson]

Of course if Travis is saying he hits the black with higher power when CB is closer to pink area with LH side and is still able to hold the spot I would like to see someone do that on an angled pot. That is not possible and you don't use helping side to throw the OB in AND hold the same spot because you increase the cut angle.

Your original question to me was pot a 3/4-black and stop the cueball dead. I have been playing these shots forever (usually on reds) to hold position and I always use that 'inside english'.

[Terry Davidson]

not read all the above but, if in your book there is no so called throw and its curving onto bob then the white wouldnt hold, if anything it should in theory run on after contact with an angled shot.

j6...to clarify, the cueball is BELOW the black (i.e. - closer to the pink than the top cushion) and you would use RH side to make for a more dead-in shot as at low speed CB throw from RH side to the left gets overtaken by the RH side and CB will hit the black more straight-on. If you hit harder you wouldn't be able to hold the spot as CB would hit the black on the 3/4 point. You have to hit low power, at dead weight to stop the CB.

I think when Travis says the CB is 'high' on the black is where the confusion is. If he is 'high' on the black then the CB is towards the top cushion but because of the TV coverage they say 'below the black' to mean closer to the cushion, and 'high' on the black to mean between black and pink spots. If you are above the black in correct terminology then it would be a cut-back black and LH side is correct but if you are low on the black with correct terminology then it would be RH side.

You have to use what the Americans say is 'inside english' and with the CB 'high' on the black (towards pink spot) it would be RH side as in your video I believe.

For those players who don't know, the top spot was originally what today's black spot in snooker was called and the bottom of the table is the baulk area. That why we call the black pocket the 'top pockets'. The TV commentators always use the wrong terminology I guess to make it easier for the uneducated to follow because the pink look to be above the black on TV.

I doubt there's any real confusion as you know yourself you have to use that 'inside english' to hold the CB and make the pot. What Travis said was he used helping side to hold the CB and that's just wrong.

[j6uk]

Only LH side if you are level or above the black (meaning towards the top cushion using the correct terminology). Even if you don't believe the CB is curling you have to admit in order to hold the CB you have to hit the black thicker. If you end up hitting it dead-on as j6 asked then you'll kill all the energy in the CB. So in my curve theory I would curve the CB into a thicker contact with the black.

Do you get exactly the opposite effect with SIT? If so I've been playing these shots wrong all my life (but still making them and getting position somehow).

not read all the above but, if in your book there is no so called throw and its curving onto bob then the white wouldnt hold, if anything it should in theory run on after contact with an angled shot.

[travisbickle]

Only LH side if you are level or above the black (meaning towards the top cushion using the correct terminology). Even if you don't believe the CB is curling you have to admit in order to hold the CB you have to hit the black thicker. If you end up hitting it dead-on as j6 asked then you'll kill all the energy in the CB. So in my curve theory I would curve the CB into a thicker contact with the black.

Do you get exactly the opposite effect with SIT? If so I've been playing these shots wrong all my life (but still making them and getting position somehow).

[QUOTE=Terry Davidson;939687]

That's exactly what I'm saying and have been saying. Whether you believe in CB curve or SIT is causing the effect, the only way to kill the CB is all the energy has to be transferred to the OB, which means as close to dead-on as you can get. There is just no other way to kill the CB.

So, black on spot, CB on green side of table 'below' the black (so in the pink side of the black and not the top cushion side. CB is 18" from black on a 3/4-ball angle. If you wanted to hold the spot you would hit this shot with drag and RH side so the CB is initially thrown to the left and then due to the slow pace and distance recovers and curls a bit to the right to hit the black full ball or nearly so. The trick is to learn the aiming point of the cue which will take practice from newbys.

Different shot if you want to power the cueball around 2 cushions. With top right and tons of power you aim the cue thicker to compensate for CB throw-off due to right hand side. For a dead weight shot on the black the aiming point will be different and a bit thinner.

If you are playing a high 3/4 black or red to hold why would you use right hand side as you are just pushing the OB to the left making it even harder to hold the shot.
Left hand side means you can hit OB thicker pushing it to the right. Simples.

[Terry Davidson]

[QUOTE=travisbickle;939685]

Only LH side if you are level or above the black (meaning towards the top cushion using the correct terminology). Even if you don't believe the CB is curling you have to admit in order to hold the CB you have to hit the black thicker. If you end up hitting it dead-on as j6 asked then you'll kill all the energy in the CB. So in my curve theory I would curve the CB into a thicker contact with the black.

Do you get exactly the opposite effect with SIT? If so I've been playing these shots wrong all my life (but still making them and getting position somehow).[/QUOTE)

You have to hit the OB thicker to throw it in. Hence less momentum on the CB. This thread is starting to make sense now lol

That's exactly what I'm saying and have been saying. Whether you believe in CB curve or SIT is causing the effect, the only way to kill the CB is all the energy has to be transferred to the OB, which means as close to dead-on as you can get. There is just no other way to kill the CB.

So, black on spot, CB on green side of table 'below' the black (so in the pink side of the black and not the top cushion side. CB is 18" from black on a 3/4-ball angle. If you wanted to hold the spot you would hit this shot with drag and RH side so the CB is initially thrown to the left and then due to the slow pace and distance recovers and curls a bit to the right to hit the black full ball or nearly so. The trick is to learn the aiming point of the cue which will take practice from newbys.

Different shot if you want to power the cueball around 2 cushions. With top right and tons of power you aim the cue thicker to compensate for CB throw-off due to right hand side. For a dead weight shot on the black the aiming point will be different and a bit thinner.

[travisbickle]

[QUOTE=Terry Davidson;939682]Only LH side if you are level or above the black (meaning towards the top cushion using the correct terminology). Even if you don't believe the CB is curling you have to admit in order to hold the CB you have to hit the black thicker. If you end up hitting it dead-on as j6 asked then you'll kill all the energy in the CB. So in my curve theory I would curve the CB into a thicker contact with the black.

Do you get exactly the opposite effect with SIT? If so I've been playing these shots wrong all my life (but still making them and getting position somehow).[/QUOTE)

You have to hit the OB thicker to throw it in. Hence less momentum on the CB. This thread is starting to make sense now lol

[Terry Davidson]

Back to work now. Play the shot Tel and you'll see

I have many times and I know

[throtts]

I ended up level with the black on its spot, Tel. Not low , as I did state, for a blind cut back pot.

Sorry , it me explaining poorly..

[Terry Davidson]

No it's definitely left hand side to hold for the black Tel

Only LH side if you are level or above the black (meaning towards the top cushion using the correct terminology). Even if you don't believe the CB is curling you have to admit in order to hold the CB you have to hit the black thicker. If you end up hitting it dead-on as j6 asked then you'll kill all the energy in the CB. So in my curve theory I would curve the CB into a thicker contact with the black.

Do you get exactly the opposite effect with SIT? If so I've been playing these shots wrong all my life (but still making them and getting position somehow).

[travisbickle]

Back to work now. Play the shot Tel and you'll see

[throtts]

im okay but nowhere near your level in terms of natural ability and achievements, which makes your understanding of all this stuff all the more remarkable.
i will do another vid with a few more shots like straightening but for now i only have this. and from what i saw behind the line noway did the white make the correct contact point on bob.

Here it is, guys. I listen to J's vid again laters..

[Terry Davidson]

Who is talking about the black lol

It was throtts asking about the black. He says he uses LH side to hold the CB on this shot however he ends up 'low' on the black, in other words closer to the cushion. A cut-back black is a harder shot which also dictates the CB must go up table but if throtts used RH side to hold the CB for an angle the other way he has choices on where the CB can go, either above or below the black.

[travisbickle]

OK, pottr's vid was with a red, this is his Video 1 and that was the same as having the CB technically 'below' the red on a 3/4-pot. From green side that has to be RH side to hold the CB. If I remember the j6 video, the first red was a cut-back red with the CB sort of level with the red and for certain j6 used RH side because the CB came off the cushion to the right for the pink position (although he missed the red by catching it thick).

Our difference of opinion is either over the technical terms or else you have a weird idea of how to stop a CB. You have to make a thicker contact with the OB in order to hold the CB.

No it's definitely left hand side to hold for the black Tel
The J6 shot is the one that Pottr played..red above the black. Play this shot with right hand side and the CB goes to low.