Brexit, in or out.

[itsnoteasy]

Because I know they are. Farage has long admitted to being Thatcher's child. He favours tax cuts for the rich, that hurts the poor. We all know this. There have been endless scandals where UKIP supporters have been caught making racist remarks. UKIP absorbed a lot of the BNP supporters and voters. These are facts.

The Independent can hardly be accused of being left wing, hence it's name. Have a read of this:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-10062731.html

Totally agree with you Cannonball, why any left leaning voters voted for them I have no idea ,but they did in their tens of thousands.
The right win because the left divide their votes, Labour, Libdems, SNP, Greens, UKIP, whereas all right wing voters vote Tory even if they don't like them, when push comes to shove the hand may shake but the X will go in the Tory box at voting time. So they always have a consistent block of votes.

[Cannonball]

Totally agree with you Cannonball, why any left leaning voters voted for them I have no idea ,but they did in their tens of thousands.
The right win because the left divide their votes, Labour, Libdems, SNP, Greens, UKIP, whereas all right wing voters vote Tory even if they don't like them, when push comes to shove the hand may shake but the X will go in the Tory box at voting time. So they always have a consistent block of votes.

I think we need a republic on the French model, no religion in schools. And no private schools either, just the cream rising to the top. The toffs do nothing for us and the political parties are dreadful. We need to start again, including getting back more sovereignty. That's not quite like me saying Leave, it's more of a reform we need. Some effects of the EU are good, some are dreadful. It would be good if the two camps admitted this obvious fact so we can have a proper debate. Adversarial politics is pretty childish, negative, nasty and it turns the electorate off.

[vmax4steve]

Michael Foot gave us no choice on who to vote for, not Margaret Thatcher. I think it's time to drop the 'Thatcher ruined everything' line.

Thatcher systematically destroyed british industry in the 80's, putting millions on the dole, she was hated and only saved by the Falklands war.
She sold off the council houses as part of her plan to break the unions, those on strike could get housing benefit for council housing, but nothing for a mortgage. Hundreds of thousands of council houses built after WW2 sold off on a discount with the tory lies about dreams of home ownership, what cobblers. Your council house was your home for life if you paid your rent and looked after it, and when you shuffled off this mortal coil it went to someone else, even maybe one of your own children.
The banks made billions from mortgages of social housing when financial restriction were lifted in the 80's, once only building societies could give mortgages, that's why they existed.

Now social housing is only given to the most needy as there are so few to go around, the most needy are those usually on benefits, my sister was one, a single parent needing a home. She was given a three bedroomed council house, got herself a live in boyfriend, lived in it for three years before being able to discount buy it for £15000, then sold it on after three years for £70000, moved to France and blew it all away on a failed business venture with said idiot boyfriend.

That's a good home gone, and £55000 leaving the country, bloody disgrace. People were so proud of their council homes after the war, honest hard working people with a home for life that they looked after, my grandparents a great example.
In north devon in the '60's there was a huge building programme of council housing and industrial estates to cater for overspill from london. Lots of light industry and their workers moved down from the smoke and fitted right in, did anyone see the BBC docu last week about the last whites of the east end ?
Could do with some of that overspill again, take the pressure off london, escape from East Ham where there are only 15% white people left, over 140 different languages spoken, most streets and estates completely take over by migrants wearing middle eastern clothing and wailing and prostrating themselves before their imaginary gods.

Come to britain by all means, bring your art, your music and your food with you, but leave behind your silly clothes that do not suit our climate, and leave behind your religion. Learn to speak english and live like the rest of us; fit in, integrate, play football and cricket and snooker, go down the pub for a pint on a friday night, you may have darker skin than us but if you work and play like us you will be accepted.

It's religion that divides, so lose it. There's no such thing as gods, or angels or devils or witches or elves or pixies or leprechauns or father christmas or yetis or bigfoot. Fire and brimstone comes from volcanoes, floods from weather events, geological action and legends from the ending of the ice age. It's completely natural to be heterosexual, homosexual or bi sexual, if you are hearing voices in your head then you're suffering from schizophrenia not listening to god (so by definition any belief founded on such voices is surely mad). If your teenage daughter is sleeping around then she's seeking and needing sexual comfort not possessed by a witch, if your son is going around gay bashing then he's also gay and projecting that religious hatred of himself onto others, which is what ISIS is all about, the old Spartan edict of the patriarchal society where women are nothing more than child bearers. Check out Bacha Bazi amongst the Taliban to see evidence of it.

Jeremy Corbyn has a chance to bring back old labour values, he's lost the ordinary working class vote with his endless desperation at not being racist, jumping on the remain bandwagon is another sympton of that. He needs to connect with the core labour voters that left the party believing themselves to be better than working class and signing up to the Thatcher/Blair/Cameron/ Johnson edict of a classless britain, the divisions are still there only now we are divided by money, ignorance and led by lies.

We can make a start by leaving the EU, let's be british again, there's nothing wrong with it. I myself have a german great grandfather on my mothers side and Irish grandfather on my fathers side, but I never thought about goose stepping with the NDP or joining the IRA, I considered myself english and have never been prejudiced against anyone from another country, but when someone answers a question with the words 'as a muslim' or 'as a christian' ...................................

[ADR147]

Yes very true, we have amazing talents and capabilities.
Aston Martin is a good example.

The only people who say that are people who have never driven one, they look amazing but they drive like a landrover!

[vmax4steve]

Totally agree with you Cannonball, why any left leaning voters voted for them I have no idea ,but they did in their tens of thousands.
The right win because the left divide their votes, Labour, Libdems, SNP, Greens, UKIP, whereas all right wing voters vote Tory even if they don't like them, when push comes to shove the hand may shake but the X will go in the Tory box at voting time. So they always have a consistent block of votes.

Don't forget the hundreds of years of the feudal system, the doffing of caps and bowing to those with a posh voice, still happening I'm afraid. Some people need to be led.

[vmax4steve]

I think we need a republic on the French model

We can start by guillotining the aristocrats, I'll sit by the basket with my knitting

[ghost121]

We can start by guillotining the aristocrats, I'll sit by the basket with my knitting

And I'll pull the lever...

[jim evans]

Anybody kept count of whose in and out.

[ADR147]

Anybody kept count of whose in and out.

Not on here but in the UK in general it looks like being a coin toss.

[itsnoteasy]

Don't forget the hundreds of years of the feudal system, the doffing of caps and bowing to those with a posh voice, still happening I'm afraid. Some people need to be led.

Bang on the spot Vmax, we feel we are inferior, we want a class system, that's why we want a monarchy, a family that believe they are appointed by God to rule over us and we want that. Until that's gone we will never have a meritocracy.
If you want to start a count, I'm probably voting in, but I feel like voting out just to get rid of Cameron, I have never seen such a Hornswoggler lead us.

[itsnoteasy]

The only people who say that are people who have never driven one, they look amazing but they drive like a landrover!

Slightly off topic so sorry but I love my cars so I have to ask, is that right ADR, in what way? Handling, suspension, comfort,?
My son is saving for a Nissan GT-R, any knowledge on them lol.

[Leo]

Slightly off topic so sorry but I love my cars so I have to ask, is that right ADR, in what way? Handling, suspension, comfort,?
My son is saving for a Nissan GT-R, any knowledge on them lol.

My mate has one of those the GTR bloody mental thing that is, quickest thing I've ever sat in my life.

[itsnoteasy]

My mate has one of those the GTR bloody mental thing that is, quickest thing I've ever sat in my life.

He's got half the money saved ( it's around forty grand for a decent secondhand one) .So maybe in eighteen months to two years he will get it, there are a couple floating around Carlisle, the good thing about them is ,unless you know what you are looking at ,it just looks like a nice motor, not the super car it is. Is it as mental off the line as it looks Leo?

[Cannonball]

We can start by guillotining the aristocrats, I'll sit by the basket with my knitting

If you are knitting the new flag, I'll supply the wool. There's an arrogant earl sitting right next to me, he's first up. I can use his 10000 acres far better than he can. Agricultural College indeed, after a hugely expensive private education. See what I mean?

INE: are you talking about the Ultima?

* Sorry, just read back, I think you meant an Aston. Very good cars, nothing like a Series land rover, unless you've driven block and tackle before, which most haven't. Modern land rovers, the TD5 onwards are a doddle to drive. The last incarnation was more like a transit than a true landie. My objection to Aston is the engine is in the wrong place for true balance, it's heavy and fat for a sports car, a bit old school. A nice Ultima will cane it (and a Veyron) for a third of the money and you'll have way more fun. I'd rather drive an MR2 III instead or a plain boxster, far more engaging. Lotus over Aston every day.

[Leo]

He's got half the money saved ( it's around forty grand for a decent secondhand one) .So maybe in eighteen months to two years he will get it, there are a couple floating around Carlisle, the good thing about them is ,unless you know what you are looking at ,it just looks like a nice motor, not the super car it is. Is it as mental off the line as it looks Leo?

Mental ain't the word, it's ridiculous