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Opinion on Ronnie declining the 147?

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  • Hatcherjob:

    What a well written post. I agree with everything you said there.
    WPBSA Level 2 - 1st4Sport Coach
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    • Originally posted by daffie View Post
      Loser...maybe not so. T0sser...oh yes, very much so.
      Thats a very different arguement.
      After 15 reds and 15 blacks i did this http://youtu.be/DupuczMS2o4

      Comment


      • Originally posted by acpc89 View Post
        I find it amazingly strange how people feel so offended as though they were entitled to watch a 147. Also the fact that people keep mentioning the poor fans who have paid their hard earn cash to see Ronnie play and deserve the 147. No, they do not. You pay for what you get, and whether he got beat 4:1 today or won 4:1 with 4 147's or not its what you get. No one deserves anything when watching snooker. However when you pay or just watch Ronnie playing, chances are your going to be entertained more so than other players.

        I do think he would of made the 147 had the audience/fans not been irritating him so much in the early stages of the match. But that's neither here nor there. I feel somewhat happy that he didnt make the 147, because had he done so, it would of just been another 147. With the usual superlatives 'genius', 'amazing', 'mozart of snooker' been used. Since he didnt make a 147, its now causing more lines to be written about snooker and himself which can only be good.

        Also, people who keep moaning about 10k is a massive amount of cash for the hard working public, so what? I've never even had close to a quarter of that amount! And I do not feel hard done by, neither should anyone else. Ronnie is not a normal average Joe Bloggs. He can make more money away from Snooker yet chooses to play. As Barry Hearn recently said, no one player is bigger than any sport, but Ronnie is the closest it will ever be.

        People should just enjoy watching him play, regardless of his on table antics. As there won't be another player like him.
        Spot on!!!

        Comment


        • Without fans there is no sport, that's just a fact, empty venues tv soon pulls out, no tv no sponsors. So what are you entitled to see for your ticket money, Ronnie just thrashing the balls around like he did in the German masters because he couldnt be arsed? Is that good for the game, is he bothered about his fans, or just himself, anyone who thinks these top players don't have a responsibility to the game don't like snooker they just like Ronnie and they are the reason the game is dying, self interested just out for what they can get, feck the good of the game, I just love Ronnie he's such a character, he can do no wrong. I don't beleive in the excuse that because you are good at something you should be excused from poor behaviour, that just encourages it, and sets a poor example to the next generation.
          This is how you play darts ,MVG two nines in the same match!
          https://youtu.be/yqTGtwOpHu8

          Comment


          • Originally posted by scottley View Post
            Thats a very different arguement.
            It's just my 0.02 and opinion on ROS.

            The only completely non-egotistical thing imo he ever did was showing compassion and comforting Ding at his 10-3 defeat in the 2006-2007 Masters Final, and calling out his 'fans' saying 'why don't you just leave, nobody wants you here' (or words to that effect).
            Last edited by daffie; 16th February 2016, 05:34 PM.

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            • Btw how much the World of snooker has changed since BH took over. Former chairman of WPBSA said at that time...

              Earlier, World Snooker chairman Walker defended his decision to allow O'Sullivan to waive his media duties. Walker said he agreed the concession for fear O'Sullivan would boycott the event but added: "No sportsman is bigger than the sport itself, and that includes Ronnie."

              http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/othersports/article-430414/Ding-left-tears-race-row-mars-OSullivan-Masters-final-win.html

              Comment


              • Originally posted by itsnoteasy View Post
                Without fans there is no sport, that's just a fact, empty venues tv soon pulls out, no tv no sponsors. So what are you entitled to see for your ticket money, Ronnie just thrashing the balls around like he did in the German masters because he couldnt be arsed? Is that good for the game, is he bothered about his fans, or just himself, anyone who thinks these top players don't have a responsibility to the game don't like snooker they just like Ronnie and they are the reason the game is dying, self interested just out for what they can get, feck the good of the game, I just love Ronnie he's such a character, he can do no wrong. I don't beleive in the excuse that because you are good at something you should be excused from poor behaviour, that just encourages it, and sets a poor example to the next generation.
                Wholeheartedly agree!

                Btw...just because you are a character doesn't mean that you have character (infamous words of Mr Wolf)
                Last edited by daffie; 16th February 2016, 05:43 PM.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Hatcherjob View Post
                  Issues like this reflect far greater on us than it does on the artist. It certainly shows what political parties everyone votes for. I remember Tony Wilson used to tell Shaun Ryder he was a true poet and Ryder would dismiss this, as he had no education in poetry. In much the same way, I don't think Ronnie understands he is an artist and quite articulates the artistic statements he makes, simply because as a snooker player, he does not fit the profile. However, what he did yesterday was very akin to the artistic merits of KLF burning a million pound on an island and the 'Leeds 13' holiday-grant fiasco... he was holding a mirror at us. We in the west have a very unhealthy obsession with money, in the way an anorexic has for food. As far as I am aware, nobody in the history of professional snooker has made a 147 and donated the money to charity. If John Higgins made a 147 yesterday, where do you think it would have gone? Straight in to his bank account. And the same for Ronnie. So this idea that the money could have gone to charity is an entirely extraneous point of view. Incidentally, that 10k is still in existence, just in the sponsor's pocket, rather than a player's, can't they donate it?

                  So here, we have an all too rare sports personality, putting principle before money, but we don't applaud that. We live in a magazine culture where figureheads climb and fall an imaginary ranking ladder of popularity and we cue up to judge them and comment, and the rise and falls can be dramatic. Ronaldo earns preposterous amounts controlled in turn by his ego, and we hate him for it. He donates a weeks wage to a sick child and suddenly he's a superhero. This modest act creates with it an influx of parroting social media commentators to come forth with great adulation, usually reserved for dying soldiers. But when we certify them improper, we get sanctimonious phrases like - "He's gone down in my estimation".

                  When money is either destroyed or squandered, we feel distraught, We do so because it is like they are burning our dreams and desires "Imagine what I could do with that". Yet, what somebody chooses to do with their money, really has nothing to do with us. Our self importance over somebody else's business is sickening. Ronnie has given us an abundance of joy over the years, with his genius comes madness, as it always does. So the argument that fans paid money and should have been duly rewarded with the 147 is moot. As a music fan, this reminds me of some of the enigmas I have watched live over time. They can arrive late, or not turn up at all. The next week, they reveal their unbridled genius and you excuse them, this is what you invested your interest in. On the contrary, if you spend good money on Metallica, you will always get value for money, because they provide pyrotechnics. So you are responsible for which artist you would prefer to see. If you pay to watch Shaun Murphy, then expect ultimate professionalism and robotic personality, you won't be disappointed. If you pay to watch an unpredictable enigma, then expect unpredictable enigmatic things.

                  By the way, what a masterstroke by Hearn to change his viewpoint today. Initially, it was no surprise to hear his condemnation. I doubt a man motivated by money would understand the artistic merit of another man forfeiting cash to make a point, that is not a language he understands. However, I think he realised last night that he was losing the battle. He has tried to turn the tables today with backhanded compliments and instead put the focus on the headlines Ronnie has made for snooker, which is a canny move.

                  Ultimately, we forgive geniuses when the dust settles and we understand it was all in the name of entertainment. Alex Higgins has been forgiven of nearly everything he ever did. Geniuses are rightly excused in the end. It also shows us how spurious our personal offence to said incidents are.
                  I bet the KLF have kicked themselves every single day for the past 22 years lol.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Hatcherjob View Post
                    Issues like this reflect far greater on us than it does on the artist. It certainly shows what political parties everyone votes for. I remember Tony Wilson used to tell Shaun Ryder he was a true poet and Ryder would dismiss this, as he had no education in poetry. In much the same way, I don't think Ronnie understands he is an artist and quite articulates the artistic statements he makes, simply because as a snooker player, he does not fit the profile. However, what he did yesterday was very akin to the artistic merits of KLF burning a million pound on an island and the 'Leeds 13' holiday-grant fiasco... he was holding a mirror at us. We in the west have a very unhealthy obsession with money, in the way an anorexic has for food. As far as I am aware, nobody in the history of professional snooker has made a 147 and donated the money to charity. If John Higgins made a 147 yesterday, where do you think it would have gone? Straight in to his bank account. And the same for Ronnie. So this idea that the money could have gone to charity is an entirely extraneous point of view. Incidentally, that 10k is still in existence, just in the sponsor's pocket, rather than a player's, can't they donate it?

                    So here, we have an all too rare sports personality, putting principle before money, but we don't applaud that. We live in a magazine culture where figureheads climb and fall an imaginary ranking ladder of popularity and we cue up to judge them and comment, and the rise and falls can be dramatic. Ronaldo earns preposterous amounts controlled in turn by his ego, and we hate him for it. He donates a weeks wage to a sick child and suddenly he's a superhero. This modest act creates with it an influx of parroting social media commentators to come forth with great adulation, usually reserved for dying soldiers. But when we certify them improper, we get sanctimonious phrases like - "He's gone down in my estimation".

                    When money is either destroyed or squandered, we feel distraught, We do so because it is like they are burning our dreams and desires "Imagine what I could do with that". Yet, what somebody chooses to do with their money, really has nothing to do with us. Our self importance over somebody else's business is sickening. Ronnie has given us an abundance of joy over the years, with his genius comes madness, as it always does. So the argument that fans paid money and should have been duly rewarded with the 147 is moot. As a music fan, this reminds me of some of the enigmas I have watched live over time. They can arrive late, or not turn up at all. The next week, they reveal their unbridled genius and you excuse them, this is what you invested your interest in. On the contrary, if you spend good money on Metallica, you will always get value for money, because they provide pyrotechnics. So you are responsible for which artist you would prefer to see. If you pay to watch Shaun Murphy, then expect ultimate professionalism and robotic personality, you won't be disappointed. If you pay to watch an unpredictable enigma, then expect unpredictable enigmatic things.

                    By the way, what a masterstroke by Hearn to change his viewpoint today. Initially, it was no surprise to hear his condemnation. I doubt a man motivated by money would understand the artistic merit of another man forfeiting cash to make a point, that is not a language he understands. However, I think he realised last night that he was losing the battle. He has tried to turn the tables today with backhanded compliments and instead put the focus on the headlines Ronnie has made for snooker, which is a canny move.

                    Ultimately, we forgive geniuses when the dust settles and we understand it was all in the name of entertainment. Alex Higgins has been forgiven of nearly everything he ever did. Geniuses are rightly excused in the end. It also shows us how spurious our personal offence to said incidents are.
                    Hatcher he wasn't holding a mirror up to us, no one in the whole place was bothered about how much money was available for the maxi, they just wanted to see one of the great achievements that a snooker player can do. Oh no wait there was one person bothered about the money ,Ronnie Osullivan, he's the one that was obsessed by how much, he's the one that asked repeatedly how much, even though the ref had told him, he's the one that was laughing about what he was about to do,I bet the crowd would of had a whip round to give him more money to do the maxi, so if your going to point fingers at who did what, make sure you point them in the right direction.
                    This is how you play darts ,MVG two nines in the same match!
                    https://youtu.be/yqTGtwOpHu8

                    Comment


                    • I have to say that Ronnie always produces mixed emotions with me. On the one hand, he can be hilarious and the fact he was laughing as he strolled round the table did make me chuckle. He didn't do anything technically wrong so who cares whether it's a 146 or 147, it's still a fantastic break, and when he's in full flow it's marvellous to watch.

                      On the other hand, I find his endless pronouncements about retiring boring and annoying, either put up or shut up. He can be incredibly disrespectful towards his opponents and who can forget his infantile behaviour at the China Open press conference? Cringe worthy to say the least. As is usual here, money is the real source of the problem, because there is a massive problem of wealth inequality in the world and the likes of Ronnie and your Messis and Ronaldos all live in a bubble.

                      I don't believe in the concept of money, it only benefits the wealthy, and it's telling that Ronnie can be so cavalier and stupid in his comments about trying to justify why a 147 should be worth more. A 147 is a display that shows the peak of skill in snooker, and Ronnie has already done it so often that it means almost nothing to him now (it seems).

                      Snooker is fine the way it is, I don't mind the music and flashing lights when the players are announced, but I'd hate it to go the way of darts. For me, snooker intrigues me on a mental level and I love the way you can almost feel the pressure and tension increase on critical shots, that for me is the beauty of the game. It is the best slow burner of tension and anticipation that you can get. Fair enough, when you have a runaway final that can be boring, a little bit of anticlimax, but the close matches I live for

                      Just because Ronnie is the most naturally talented player to ever pick up a cue, doesn't mean we shouldn't be critical of his behaviour, and we certainly shouldn't be putting him on any pedestal. He's no better or worse than you or me, all human beings are inherently flawed, we do need to be careful about superlatives!

                      Comment


                      • This is by far the best 1st post I have ever seen...by anyone...on any forum...period! A job well-done.

                        (btw I completely agree with every point you make)

                        Comment


                        • Gets ya talking snooker though doesn't he...

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Leo View Post
                            Another Ronnie battering thread coming up.
                            I cant stand this forum sometimes, how pathetic are some of the these people that all they do is criticize and judge. Ronnie is Ronnie, hes been doing stuff like this his whole career yet everyone still acts surprised. Hate him or love him its undeniable how good he is for the sport. People just want to run their mouths and belittle him....the guys a genius. He had his reasons for what he did wether people think its right or wrong who gives a crap. I thought it was brilliant what he did.. we always see 147's but how rare are 146's and antics like this are much more exciting IMO.

                            Comment


                            • Rumour has it Alain Robidoux still ain't speaking to him.
                              After 15 reds and 15 blacks i did this http://youtu.be/DupuczMS2o4

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by itsnoteasy View Post
                                Hatcher he wasn't holding a mirror up to us, no one in the whole place was bothered about how much money was available for the maxi, they just wanted to see one of the great achievements that a snooker player can do. Oh no wait there was one person bothered about the money ,Ronnie Osullivan, he's the one that was obsessed by how much, he's the one that asked repeatedly how much, even though the ref had told him, he's the one that was laughing about what he was about to do,I bet the crowd would of had a whip round to give him more money to do the maxi, so if your going to point fingers at who did what, make sure you point them in the right direction.
                                My only gripe with Ronnie is how he explains himself. If the decision really was solely down to 10k not being enough than I'd agree with you. However, I think it is obvious that he was being mischievous and anarchic and the '10k being too cheap' was part of the theater. I don't believe anybody really thinks that do they? Unfortunately, this kind of levity has brought in to question the charity donation idea, but I agree with what Ronnie says today about being in the moment and absorbed by matters on the table. Somebody somewhere has raised the idea of making the money and giving it to charity if its 'too cheap' for him. Well, that idea was never part of any pre-match, pre-cognitive conversation. It is not a prevailing ideology in snooker 147s. It came after some musing by somebody after the game and caught on with others. Next time a Premier League player gets a red card and receives a fine, shall we say - "Hey, why didn't you keep your cool and stay on the field, then with the money you would have had to pay, you could have given that to charity instead?" "Oh yes, obviously."

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